Hello!

[Podman]

Hi,

I've just recently joined the forum as I am intersted in buying a VR4 saloon. On looking into it I found an Advert on ebay about your site.
I live near Newport in south Wales and currently have a highly modified (forged engine with big turbo, drive train mods mainly) 400bhp rover

I'm trying to get some info on what I can do to the car once I buy it if I like it once I go to see it. Not sure why but everytime I try to look at things on here that I think will be useful to me and give me extra persuasion (such as the article on fitting boost controller(I have an Apexi AVCR sat here waiting shoudl I need it) it says that I do not have permission to read it, how do I get permission then ?

[Nutter_John]

To view the members section you need to pay a yearly fee of 20 pounds , well worth , if you select clubvr4 drop down up top and there is a join club selection

[Wodjno]

Hi,

I've just recently joined the forum as I am intersted in buying a VR4 saloon. On looking into it I found an Advert on ebay about your site.
I live near Newport in south Wales and currently have a highly modified (forged engine with big turbo, drive train mods mainly) 400bhp rover

I'm trying to get some info on what I can do to the car once I buy it if I like it once I go to see it. Not sure why but everytime I try to look at things on here that I think will be useful to me and give me extra persuasion (such as the article on fitting boost controller(I have an Apexi AVCR sat here waiting shoudl I need it) it says that I do not have permission to read it, how do I get permission then ?

Hi

Welcome to the Club :D

You can do most of what you have done to your Rover.

Single Turbo conversion and larger Twin Turbo conversions have been done by club members :2thumbsup
Electronic or manual boost Controller can be fitted to raise standard boost from approx 7-8psi to 14psi.
Piggyback ECU to alter fuel, timing etc.
FMIC
De-Cat
More free flowing exhaust
Uprated brakes. If facelift car then easy upgrade to Brembo's
Hard pipe hit for Bloating Turbo pipes
etc etc etc.

All the Juicy Info is via Membership. A paltry £20 that will pay for itself 100 times over.. Hope this helps some :happy:

EDIT: Oh Yes ! And a few Members have also Fitted Nitrous to there cars with good effect :D

[Podman]

Guess I better fork out the 20 quid !

[Nick Mann]

Welcome! Most info is around, try searching. Members have access to the library and members articles. Between us we are trying to put together all the info on the VR4. We are not quite there yet, but we have a lot of info already.

As said above: Exhaust, boost controller and piggyback should get you well into the low 300's. Mid 300's are possible with a very good set up. To move to 400's you either need a 75 (or more!) shot of laughing gas, or bigger turbos. Our turbos are too small to get the flow required for much over 350.

People have run 330ish plus 100 of nos, on standard internals and drivetrain, so not sure when internals are required yet!

[Podman]

If I were adding just exhaust air filter and Apexi AVCR what kinda boost can the engine handle ? How are they on fueling and standard mapping ? what is the boost limit of teh standard map ?

Thanks for the info by teh way. Looks like I shall be buying on esoon the more I hear about them !

[SGHOM]

People have run 330ish plus 100 of nos, on standard internals and drivetrain, so not sure when internals are required yet!

:scholar: :2thumbsup :2thumbsup

[Nick Mann]

Many people run around 0.9bar with no mapping. Boost cut is the problem when you hit the limits of the standard map - the ecu freaks 'cause it thinks you are leaning out, so cuts fuel. The cars run rich as standard, so there is a safety margin on just upping boost. I would personally recommend a piggyback and tune up, just 'cause it improved mine so much from when it wasn't set up properly!

[Podman]

What sort of ecu's and costs are involved ? I have just sold of a DTA S60 ECU taht used to run my car so I'll be gutte dif I have to buy another one similar and pay top whack lol

[Nutter_John]

The piggy back ones cost around 500 quid(unichip) , or you could go the whole hog and get a Link g2 but expect around at least 1500 with setup

From what I recall both Derek ( SGHOM) and Nick Mann use the unichip method , Glen ( WODJNO) uses an Greddy Ultimate which he has mapped himself

[Brunty]

Hi Podman,

As said before hope you enjoy the site.

We are fortunate to have some very capable members when it comes to the mechanical side of things, as you're begining to find we don't have masses of bolt-on goodies available to us. There a probably a dozen or so UK members who have invested considerable time, money and effort into improving the performance of their own VR4s, and they share their findings to the benefit of us all. All told a beneficial and very friendly club to be a member of.

/Welcome2

Steve

[SGHOM]

. All told a beneficial and very friendly club to be a member of.

Steve

you been drinking again Steve ?? :happy: :happy: :5shots:

[Wodjno]

What sort of ecu's and costs are involved ? I have just sold of a DTA S60 ECU taht used to run my car so I'll be gutte dif I have to buy another one similar and pay top whack lol

Piggy back ECU's can range from a couple of Hundred to a Grand. :speechles
E-manage Blue and Ultimate will give you what you need and these can be had for less than £200 for 2nd hand Blue and £400 for the a New Ultimate.

I'm running an Ultimate and so is Valmes. ( And so should 'The Vee' be, once he pulls his finger out) Pezza, BigDaveakers and Bonsai boy are running Blues.

See here for all info on these. http://www.mohdparts.com/emanage/index.html

There are other options but i'll have to leave that for other members to quote on :happy:

[Wodjno]

you been drinking again Steve ?? :happy: :happy: :5shots:

Are you not Drinking Derek :speechles

[Podman]

having come from the rover community I am well accustomed to cars with few, if any bolt on goodies, unfortunately with rovers they are also week engine and rarely hold more than 50bhp above standard. idea of this car is Jap reliability and strength yet still a challange to upgrade without having to go whole hig with forged internals. Piggy back ecu's I have never used before so I'm kinda in the dark with them, I just sold my dta ecu which could happily have run this engine for 400 quid, wishing I hadn't now. Although I'm sure building the loom would have been a nightmare on one of these.

All in all I want around 350 - 400 bhp reliable power from one of these things which from replies is not to costly at all. Really am looking forward to getting my hands dirty on this one. If I can get 400bhp from my rover (which I still have the turbo from ;) ) then these should be a relaxing change to mod without hammering the life out of my wallet. Rover cost me more money than I care to think about, block/head alone cost me 7k. This car is to keep my bank manager happy and stop me having to spend so much. It will be my first 4wd. Let the fun begin !!!!! lol


Seems like a nice small, but friendly community that I am looking forward to getting into and learning from.

Thanks for all your replies

Huw.

[Podman]

Piggy back ECU's can range from a couple of Hundred to a Grand. :speechles
E-manage Blue and Ultimate will give you what you need and these can be had for less than £200 for 2nd hand Blue and £400 for the a New Ultimate.

I'm running an Ultimate and so is Valmes. ( And so should 'The Vee' be, once he pulls his finger out) Pezza, BigDaveakers and Bonsai boy are running Blues.

See here for all info on these. http://www.mohdparts.com/emanage/index.html

There are other options but i'll have to leave that for other members to quote on :happy:


do these things require looms to be made up or are they available off the shelf to fit ?

[SGHOM]

All in all I want around 350 - 400 bhp reliable power from one of these things Huw.

that may be a tad optimistic. 300 maybe. just buy one & enjoy the amazing amount of grip they have on a track. :2thumbsup in the right hands, they will outhandle a skyline. :evilgrin:

[Nick Mann]

7k? Feck! Some outline prices:

Exhaust, cat back, custom stainless £450.
Boost controoler Free! You've already got one!
Piggyback - Unichip will do it if you want to pay someone to tune - approx £600 installed and set up. EManage better if you want to set up yourself - £200ish to buy.
Intercooler - how much do you want to spend?!
Evo Brembos - £500 should get a full 2nd hand set in good serviceable condition. (That's 4 calipers, 4 discs, all pads.)
Evo wheels to put them behind, again, good condition second hand - £400.

That should give a fun, enjoyable, reliable 330bhp.

If you want 400 bhp, then you are talking turbo upgrades, so the money starts shooting skywards! You'll also need at least an uprated fuel pump and fpr to fuel 400 bhp. Any more than that and you will also need bigger injectors. At that point, your 7k is probably a budget quote!!

[Wodjno]

do these things require looms to be made up or are they available off the shelf to fit ?

They come complete with wiring harnesses that need to be cut and spliced into the standard ECU loom. :inquisiti Not as difficult as it sounds, just a case of matching the wires from the e-manage to the ecu. As far a i know Myself, BDA, Valmes and Pezza all fitted theres themselves.(And Tuned) :scholar:
All the relevent ECU pinouts and wiring colours are available on site. :happy:


By the way ! What rover was it that you had ?

[Podman]

Started life as a rover 620ti. Ended up as a never ending money pit with a 2.2 totally forged engine with flowed and ported head and a t30 turbo with a flow rate of over 400bhp (about 460 estimated). Real sleeper of a thing. I have kept a few items I thought maybe universal such as the avcr. Top speed was around 175 on road and did 211 on rollers (non standard ratios of course) buyt it's biggest fall down was traction, front wheel drive even with the racelogic traction control system I installed just didnt work at all till you were already doing high speeds which is no good on normal roads.

[Wodjno]

Started life as a rover 620ti. Ended up as a never ending money pit with a 2.2 totally forged engine with flowed and ported head and a t30 turbo with a flow rate of over 400bhp (about 460 estimated). Real sleeper of a thing. I have kept a few items I thought maybe universal such as the avcr. Top speed was around 175 on road and did 211 on rollers (non standard ratios of course) buyt it's biggest fall down was traction, front wheel drive even with the racelogic traction control system I installed just didnt work at all till you were already doing high speeds which is no good on normal roads.

Had a Ti myself as did a few other VR4 owners( 3 i think) :thinking: Only had it running at 230bhp, but that was enough through the fronts with no aftermarket TC. Suppose you had a lot of dealings with Motobuild then :scholar:
Wasn't Green was it :inquisiti

[Podman]

nope,nothing from motobodge. All came from www.gb-ent.com

Good bloke who knows his stuff with engines.

[Kieran]

Can't really add much as Derek, Glenn and Nick have taken care of it all - other than to say /Welcome to ClubVR-4 and hope you enjoy the place - We like to think we're a friendly and helpful bunch of peeps!:2thumbsup

The big thing with the VR-4 is the grip. The AYC finds grip at speeds where most other cars would be presenting you with a choice of roadside objects to plough into! Certainly, the experience won't be as raw and visceral as I imagine your Rover is (Still a T-Series block?), but they are still a deceptively quick car as standard and they do respond well to modifications. As others have said, 300~330bhp is possible without major wallet surgery, above that you start to max out the teeny-tiny TD03 turbos we have - though with the right mods they will hang on to about 1.1/1.2 bar before they start melting things!

[Podman]

Can't really add much as Derek, Glenn and Nick have taken care of it all - other than to say /Welcome to ClubVR-4 and hope you enjoy the place - We like to think we're a friendly and helpful bunch of peeps!:2thumbsup

The big thing with the VR-4 is the grip. The AYC finds grip at speeds where most other cars would be presenting you with a choice of roadside objects to plough into! Certainly, the experience won't be as raw and visceral as I imagine your Rover is (Still a T-Series block?), but they are still a deceptively quick car as standard and they do respond well to modifications. As others have said, 300~330bhp is possible without major wallet surgery, above that you start to max out the teeny-tiny TD03 turbos we have - though with the right mods they will hang on to about 1.1/1.2 bar before they start melting things!



Yes it was still a t series block, but had been bored out given forged pistons (ceramic coated) steel rods and a stroked forged crank. interestingg to drive to say the least.

[Wodjno]

Yes it was still a t series block, but had been bored out given forged pistons (ceramic coated) steel rods and a stroked forged crank. interestingg to drive to say the least.

No Mahle (chocalate) ones in there then ? /help

[Podman]

no I didn't have mahle pistons as the car was to new. did origionally have the "chocolate" pistons though. Don't think they'd have lasted long having 1.7bar banged through em though.

Engine was string as hell once finished, shame teh handling was not upto the power of the engine. 4wd looses a shed load of power by the time it gets to the wheels, but at least it grips to make up for the loss. Having never really had a 4wd car before I don't quite know what to expect from it day in day out kina thing. My biggets winge on the Ti was most definately handling performance. No amount of polly bushes, coilovers sticky tyres and traction control could make it handle like I would have liked. The VR4 should really impress me by the sounds. REALLY looking forward to getting the VR4 now. I don't really think the lesser power is gonna bother me that much. Handling is what I have craved for a while now.

[Wodjno]

I certainly don't think your going to have a lack of power :speechles

The biggest thing you might have a problem with though is 1 thing that hasn't been mentioned /help

Fuel consumption :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots:

They drink more than Derek(SGHOM)/pan

[Podman]

I think I still have this hanging around somewhere

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y214/podman2004/Manifold/DSC00699.jpg

Would that kind of intercooler find a home on a VR4 or is there not the space behind a standard bumper ?

[Wodjno]

I think I still have this hanging around somewhere

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y214/podman2004/Manifold/DSC00699.jpg

Would that kind of intercooler find a home on a VR4 or is there not the space behind a standard bumper ?

Pics not uploading, so can't see what you have posted. :thinking:

I have a 600x300x100 inercooler that fits snug. Is the one your trying to post larger than that ??

[Podman]

I certainly don't think your going to have a lack of power :speechles

The biggest thing you might have a problem with though is 1 thing that hasn't been mentioned /help

Fuel consumption :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots: :5shots:

They drink more than Derek(SGHOM)/pan


And you think a 400bhp rover didn't ???? lol

I have not really worried about fuel consumption, as long as it does early to mid 20's say to day without htrashing thats good enough for me

[Wodjno]

And you think a 400bhp rover didn't ???? lol

I have not really worried about fuel consumption, as long as it does early to mid 20's say to day without htrashing thats good enough for me

i normally average around 13 to 15mpg day to day driving .. I've averaged as low as 9mpg on a full tank. And on track you can go sub 5mpg /help

Best i had was around 28mpg.. But that was totally boring :inquisiti

[Podman]

Yike !!!! how the hell can a 400bhp rover average better than a 280bhp mitsi !!!! something seriosuly up there.


on average over a tank going back and for to work and a bit of playing about in teh 7.5k revs region I used to get around 22mpg over a tank.


Hmm..... thats quite heavy fuel consumption then.

[Wodjno]

Yike !!!! how the hell can a 400bhp rover average better than a 280bhp mitsi !!!! something seriosuly up there.


on average over a tank going back and for to work and a bit of playing about in teh 7.5k revs region I used to get around 22mpg over a tank.


Hmm..... thats quite heavy fuel consumption then.

Don't think mines quite 280 :scholar:

Round the Nurburgring, i couldn't manage 4 full laps without getting fuel starvation :inquisiti Thats approx 52mls. Divide that by 12 gallons :speechles

Extra weight and driving 4 wheels adds to the consumption !

[Podman]

on average teh rover did about 200 miles on a tank of 60 litres. So I guess not to far out really. Did as much as 300 on long (and I mean long !) runs of cruising at 75- 80 mph.

Don't sound all that differnt really. I'm considering a 2 nd car for back and for work anyway. Driving a rover 400 diesel at teh mo. Been using it all week and haven't had to refil the tank yet, although I'm sur ethe novelty of good fuel consumption will wear off and I'll end up taking teh VR4 to work now and again.

[Wodjno]

, although I'm sur ethe novelty of good fuel consumption will wear off and I'll end up taking teh VR4 to work now and again.

I know exactly what you mean there :evilgrin:

I drive a Pug 106 back and forth to work. 105mile round trip. :inquisiti If i did the daily commute in the VR4 it would cost me around 8-10k a year.(and thats if nothing broke)
It doesn't even cost me 2 gallons of fuel in the Pug. :scholar: But as you say, temptation is always the /help And a full tank of petrol can be reduced to edging on the redline of the fuel gauge after a Weak moment and a few cars to play with on my Journey to and From Work /pan

[The Vee]

[QUOTE=

I'm running an Ultimate and so is Valmes. ( And so should 'The Vee' be, once he pulls his finger out) Pezza, BigDaveakers and Bonsai boy are running Blues.

QUOTE]

Sorry (where's the blushing smilie when you want it!!)

But welcome to the site Podman, a finer bunch of peeps you will not meet.