Some MAP2 Questions

[mpau009]

Okay let the nagging begin:drummer: :scholar:

I'm hoping some of you UK boys who have the MAP2 will be able to help me out.

I went and got a USB serial convertor, and managed to plug my laptop in and configure the ports or whatever to make it work, but since i need a new battery for the laptop i havent made it out of the driveway yet:thinking:.

Sooo.. some questions.

I read somewhere that around 14.7 AFR is the best for emissions in closed loop, and that is what the ECU aims for? Why then would mine be around 11 - 10 (see pic) :inquisiti. Would this be related to my crappy fuel consumption, and popping and spluttering on overrun? I havent connected up the LC-1 yet, but i'm guessing something aint right.

TPS input, i think iv stuffed something up there, it shows 100% all the time. The first thing in the manual is about setting it up, but when i sample the voltage it consistently give the absolute max. I wired it up to take a feed from the TPS line in the ECU, and i assumed i left it plugged into the stock computer and spliced into it for the MAP to read and so the car will run.. any ideas? Would this be related to the sensor itself, and consequently the poor AFR?

Thirdly, Could someone spell out the ECU configuration settings for the VR4 please? Iv set the ignition tab to 6 cylinder, group fire, and i am positive i have the right ECU wires, and i thought in the right order - but the one time i tried to start the car, without changing anything the timing was off by miles, and it stank of fuel..

Fourthly.. What power source did you use for your +12v switchable? I had used a spare wire from my accessories, which is fine, except that it stops when i turn the key off, where as my turbo timer should want to keep it going. Does anyone know if you can use the power supply to the stock ecu? or is that constant?, or else which wires will stay live while the turbo timer runs? I'll get a circuit tester on the weekend, but i thought someone might know.

Any and all advice about getting it starting, and tips and tricks for the settings would be appreciated. I'll be taking it really (really) slow, but anything that might help myself and others would be ace.:2thumbsup/thankyou

[Nutter_John]

Without a LM-1 / Wibeband the reading from the stock narrowband will be useless

Please do not try and tune the car from the stock sensor as you will not have good readings , worse still you could lean out too much and pop.

Yep 6 cyl group fire ,

white to coil pack 1 ecu side , cut , attach white/black cable to wire to ignitors side
blue to coil pack 2 ecu side , cut , attach blue/black cable to wire to ignitors side
green to coil pack 3 ecu side , cut , attach green /black cable to wire to ignitors side


+12v must be attached to the same power source as your stock ecu ,which is pin 25 on the 26pin connector

[Kenneth]

If it is anything like the map-ecu, the AFR will be displayed using a configuration file that tells it what AFR is what voltage. if this isn't setup correctly (or you have it set to a wide band one when using narrow band) then the display will be incorrect (while your car may be correct)

as for the TPS config, usually you have to set it at 0 (hitting the S key or something on the keyboard while in the tps-min box) and again with the foot fully depressed when in the tps-max box.

[mpau009]

Without a LM-1 / Wibeband the reading from the stock narrowband will be useless

Please do not try and tune the car from the stock sensor as you will not have good readings , worse still you could lean out too much and pop.

Yep 6 cyl group fire ,

white to coil pack 1 ecu side , cut , attach white/black cable to wire to ignitors side
blue to coil pack 2 ecu side , cut , attach blue/black cable to wire to ignitors side
green to coil pack 3 ecu side , cut , attach green /black cable to wire to ignitors side


+12v must be attached to the same power source as your stock ecu ,which is pin 25 on the 26pin connector

Ah cool thanks for that, i'll switch to that power source. That ignition sounds identical to what i set up, maybe i'll have another go.

As for the wideband, i'll be ditching the stock o2 sensor for the Innovate LC-1 (will configure it and switch on the weekend), which will stay in permanently, it'll be interesting to see what the AFR really is once thats up and running, but you could smell the fuel just sitting there today.

Any suggestions what might be up with the TPS thing? It seems a little odd that the sample thing gets the same every time.

[mpau009]

as for the TPS config, usually you have to set it at 0 (hitting the S key or something on the keyboard while in the tps-min box) and again with the foot fully depressed when in the tps-max box.

I thought thats what i was doing, but it keeps giving the max reading? I remember fiddling with that when i first got the car and had idle issues related to air leaks, i wonder if i might have done something, or just wired it up wrong. The weathers a bit **** at the moment, but i'll have a look at that AFR setting thing tomorrow.
I really want the car to run off the LC-1, but i'll leave that till saturday just incase it turns out to be harder than it looks..

[Paul C]

for you o2 sensor you need to select the only narrowband sensor in mapcal configure list i think it is something like Lsm II or Lsn II cant remember which. All the others are wideband o2 sensors. as standard the map ecu configures this to a dynojet o2 sensor which is for wideband.

Tps, havent needed to configure mine seems to be ok as is, will have to look into it.

Settings

6 group fire
low boost map
kvf airflow meter


I think thats all you need to change for basic sensor.

[Paul C]

I have loooked into tps setup. With the engine switched off and mapecu online for tps min press i and it logs that value, press accelerator pedal full down and press 'i' again and it will log that value. My tps min was 519 and max was 3982. Your values may differ to mine. if the tps messes you around then make anote of the vaues it gives when you press 'i' and log them yourself. I did it this way and had no problems.

[mpau009]

for you o2 sensor you need to select the only narrowband sensor in mapcal configure list i think it is something like Lsm II or Lsn II cant remember which. All the others are wideband o2 sensors. as standard the map ecu configures this to a dynojet o2 sensor which is for wideband.

Tps, havent needed to configure mine seems to be ok as is, will have to look into it.

Settings

6 group fire
low boost map
kvf airflow meter


I think thats all you need to change for basic sensor.

Ahh cool, thats was what Kenneth was meaning, i'll give that a go:2thumbsup The plan a this stage is just to get it running with the ignition harness attached, get the wideband in, and logging through the MAP2, and then look at setting up a high and low boost setting and learning around that.

Paul, how come you decided to go for an aftermarket boost solenoid? were there problems with the stock one in the end?

[Nutter_John]

I choose to go an even simpler way to setup them up than Paul , I already had a Apexi installed and setup for 0.9 bar which I will be tunning the system to ( well upto 1.2 bar) then once it is all setup and stable will switch to using the internal boost controller

This makes it easier to setup as you are only changing the fueling and timming to start with not the boost etc

[Paul C]

The stock solonoid is set up as a bleed valve. I didn't know if it could be used as inline and fancied uprated model so went for that.at the moment i am having a bit of chew setting it up. dont know wether map ecu is pulsing/controlling right, or if i have boost leak, or if its piped wrong. Dont have the time to get stuck in and find out where the problem so just letting it boost at stock level for now.

[mpau009]

I have loooked into tps setup. With the engine switched off and mapecu online for tps min press i and it logs that value, press accelerator pedal full down and press 'i' again and it will log that value. My tps min was 519 and max was 3982. Your values may differ to mine. if the tps messes you around then make anote of the vaues it gives when you press 'i' and log them yourself. I did it this way and had no problems.

:inquisiti Thats exactly what iv been doing, but whenever i press 'i' it comes up with 4094 which i think is the max?

I'll have to pull the wiring out again, and make sure i havent messed anything up, and put the ignition harness back in etc, so i'll let you know how it turns out.

Also where abouts did you mount the unit itself? iv got the passengers seat out at the moment, and i dont want to mount it to the floor, since iv had amps under seats get kicked before, but the glovebox is usually full, is there somewhere good to mount it, so i can still get the serial cable on easily? Maybe make a bracket?

[bradc]

You could put it just above where the stock ecu is, and just make a harness for the serial cable to go into the glove box, or even into the ash tray.

[mpau009]

You could put it just above where the stock ecu is, and just make a harness for the serial cable to go into the glove box, or even into the ash tray.

That was my initial plan, the cable could be attached to the back of the ash tray, and come out with it, but in the MAP manual it says "disconnect the PC serial cable when tuning is completed. Do not leave the cable connected to the MAP-ECU2 during normal operation", i guess in case it shorts or something? I couldnt see the harm though:thinking:

[Paul C]

for any would be thieves i keep mine in glove box at the moment for ease of access and so i can monitor the output lights.

[Kenneth]

maybe you have the wrong wire for TPS

[Eurospec]

Sorry not to jump in before but i only just saw the thread!

When you configure the map ecu you need to tell it if the WOT is a high voltage or a low one. You normally do this through an inital set up where you sample the voltage at closed throttle and then again at WOT. So basically you have 2 numbers to sample.

If map cal is showing you 100% all the time then either you have an incorrect callibration in the map ecu set up, or you are connected on the wrong line.

also sounded like you originally had a problem in the wiring on the ign circuits, or you needed to adjust the firing order in map cal.

You also need to select the appropriate O2 sensor from the drop down boxes to enable a correct afr reading (its slightly different to the V1 in that respect, where you had to use a file). Saying that John is right, dont attempt to tune afr on the narrow band- its not really accurate enough.

Hope that helps,

Cheers,

Ben.

[mpau009]

Thanks for the replies all, i'm going to have another go at setting it up in a few minutes, and iv ordered a new battery for my laptop, should be here on monday.

Ben, do you know of any reason why the serial cable would need to be unplugged at the MAP end, as it suggests in the manual? I really would like to have the unit bolted in and right out of sight, cause i can just see a thief nicking it, which would suck.. Its a good idea to inform your insurance people too.. mine werent too keen on having $1500 of tuning stuff in the car, so i might have to switch to a company that covers a higher amount of declared accessories. Was definately worth checking.:thinking:

[Nutter_John]

will probably be due to stray signals being picked up by the serial link , doesn't look like it's a sheilded cable .

I'm going to create a shileded harness and leave it connected

[mpau009]

:2thumbsup
maybe you have the wrong wire for TPS

Yep that'll do it, i figured that the pin i tried initially was the right one for a manual, but after i looked at your MAP1 install, i switched to that wire, and it samples fine now.

The ignition harness is in and working fine as well which is good.

I am almost confident enough to plug in the LC-1 sensor, and try some boost control..

As for the serial cable sheilding thing, i dont really understand that too well, but i'm guessing its similar to the running the amp rcas away from the power, to avoid that buzz thing? Could i just look at buying a sheilded cable to replace the one that came with the unit, or is it something that has to be made?

[Kenneth]

well done :)

btw, i left the serial cable plugged in all the time... didn't have any trouble with it.

[Subaru ETA]

as for you smment about insurance mike, who you with?? i was with pionner for a year who were good and didnt give a **** bout what was in the car as long as you told them. however you have to pay them via GE finance which is gay and i had major issuses with them up to the point where they started taking money from me for no ****en reason!

so now im with asb who are much the same, as long as you tel them what you got and how much its worth they are all good...plus i pay $90 a month and that for under 25's aswell!

[mpau009]

I use the family broker, so iv changed a few times, its some combination of three letters:thinking:. I havent been too happy with them so i'll shop around a bit, basically they pay out fine, when it wasnt my fault. But i expected the premium to fall every year, and it didnt. I'm also paying about $95 a month on an agreed sum of $12.5K which i think is a bit rough since iv had the VR over a year without incident, and had clean full insurance since 2001.

[mpau009]

As for the MAP, i'm almost ready to play with boost control. Iv got the LC-1 installed and running the car in place of the OEM o2 sensor.

The problem i dont quite understand now is how to make the MAP readings and the LC-1 output match so i can log accurately.

The analog output 1 on the LC-1 is mimicking narrowband, and plugged into the ecu o2 line. The second is measuring 0-5v and plugged into the MAP2.

The problem is the MAP2 doesnt have the correct choice for the LC-1. It has the LM-1, but that measures 1-2v.
The closest is the PLX lookup table, which equates 5v = 20AFR, 0 = 10AFR, but the output on the LC-1 as it comes is 5v = 22.39AFR, 0v = 7.35AFR:inquisiti

The question i have, is if i reprogram the LC-1 analog output 2 so that it matches the PLX table, will i be logging accurately. I know the output 1 is fine since the car is running well, but if i am going to auto learn through the MAP in wideband, then it needs to accurate when i swap to MAP permanently.

Any advice..:inquisiti

[Kenneth]

As for the MAP, i'm almost ready to play with boost control. Iv got the LC-1 installed and running the car in place of the OEM o2 sensor.

The problem i dont quite understand now is how to make the MAP readings and the LC-1 output match so i can log accurately.

The analog output 1 on the LC-1 is mimicking narrowband, and plugged into the ecu o2 line. The second is measuring 0-5v and plugged into the MAP2.

The problem is the MAP2 doesnt have the correct choice for the LC-1. It has the LM-1, but that measures 1-2v.
The closest is the PLX lookup table, which equates 5v = 20AFR, 0 = 10AFR, but the output on the LC-1 as it comes is 5v = 22.39AFR, 0v = 7.35AFR:inquisiti

The question i have, is if i reprogram the LC-1 analog output 2 so that it matches the PLX table, will i be logging accurately. I know the output 1 is fine since the car is running well, but if i am going to auto learn through the MAP in wideband, then it needs to accurate when i swap to MAP permanently.

Any advice..:inquisiti

I built this one for use in mine... I cant remember if I used this or just re-calibrated the LC-1

try this, you should be able to figure out if it is correct or not by the closed loop readings.

otherwise, just re-configure the LC-1 to output between 1 and 2 volts. it doesnt change how accurate the output is, just how much voltage represents each change.

Note: remove the .txt extension in the file

[mpau009]

:pimp2: Cool thanks, i'll have a look tomorrow and let you know how i get on.