Lowered Your Legnum?

[mpau009]

Now might be a good time to rotate your tires:5shots:

I went for a warrant on sunday, and even with Glys camber mod (which OnRoad noticed, but didnt mention in their report) Iv chewed out the inside edge of both rears. The fronts are relatively even, with a 5mm measurement. But the backs.. as you can see, the outside edge is barely worn (see the little rubbery tag things)

But the inside edge is completely bald:uhoh2:

They passed it since its just a thin strip ("looks like you caught it just in time..he he he.."), but im guessing without any exit points, those GSD3 veins arent going to be clearing much water..

Once i get my suspension set to a good height, i think i'll be going back to space that rear arm even more.

I think thats like 7-8 months, maybe 15000k-ish, granted i ran them a bit soft for a few months (28-30psi) but wow, it was a shock to me, especially since they look near new from the outside.

[bradc]

did you swap them over left to right?

[Gly]

how long where those on errons lowered vr4 and yours before you did the camber mod thou?

and depending on when your last wheel alignment was...
whats the toe like on the rear, as this can cause un even ware aswell...

and your car sat alot lower than mine did,
so would have more camber..

i had 3 alignments before my camber was right,
and have had no ware problems since. (on the 25ST)

you may need more spacers to striagthen up the wheels more...

but you wont know untill your cars aligned. and they give you a report.

my guide is only a how to... and will vary on the amount off spacer needed from car to car,

[mpau009]

how long where those on errons lowered vr4 and yours before you did the camber mod thou?

and depending on when your last wheel alignment was...
whats the toe like on the rear, as this can cause un even ware aswell...

and your car sat alot lower than mine did,
so would have more camber..

i had 3 alignments before my camber was right,
and have had no ware problems since. (on the 25ST)

you may need more spacers to striagthen up the wheels more...

but you wont know untill your cars aligned. and they give you a report.

my guide is only a how to... and will vary on the amount off spacer needed from car to car,

Yeah there is something screwy. The tyres were new, i used them to replace Osiris' old ones. I had the alignment done when they fitted them, and they picked that even with stock suspension i had 3 degrees of camber on the rear. I havent had it checked since swapping to the Teins since there was no change after swapping setups on the STR. Might have been a bad decision now though methinks:baby:

Iv checked, and there doesnt seem to be anything out of place, or bent or anything like that.

I would guess that most of the wear occured before we fitted those plates and i upped the pressure to 34psi, but there is still a tonne of visible camber. (I'll try and see if i can get a good pic). I hate to think what would have happened if you hadnt helped lessen the damage... BANG!:thinking:

Once i get a cert for the adjustables, i'll get a measurement to see how bad it is.

If youv still got some of those spacers i might grab a few more.

[BraindG]

Ive not done the camber mod, but after checking my original tyres, on my old standard wheels i noticed the same thing - but, im suprised that with the camber mod its no better? :thinking:


how long where those on errons lowered vr4 and yours before you did the camber mod thou?
What was the anser to this?

Did both sides have the same amount of wear?

[mpau009]

Ive not done the camber mod, but after checking my original tyres, on my old standard wheels i noticed the same thing - but, im suprised that with the camber mod its no better? :thinking:


What was the anser to this?

Did both sides have the same amount of wear?

The tyres were new on my car as above.

Both sides are identical, I'm not knocking the camber mod, it is clearly obvious when you see them in real life how much the camber mod has helped, there is a scrubbed patch which is almost flat (the clean bit in the pic), then the rest is sort of sloped into the middle.

I was just surprised at how it happened, since i had the same 100mm ground clearance on my first Legnum STR, with no noticable wear (the rears did go first though)

I'll pop out and take a pic now.

[pezza]

Are you still using those master low cool down spec (or wotever :thinking: ) Teins?

Maybe your shocks are not as thy should be? Is the car Still bottoming out?

How low is the back?

[mpau009]

Heres some as it sits now, with a single spacer behind the top arm. You can imagine how bad it would have been without it, considering i had to put a spacer on the wheel to stop it hitting the body of the coilover..

I just thought it would be a more common problem with the number of lowered leggies i see each day:thinking:

[mpau009]

Are you still using those master low cool down spec (or wotever :thinking: ) Teins?

Maybe your shocks are not as they should be? Is the car Still bottoming out?

How low is the back?

Yeah those Teins were **** i think the shocks were tired, but the actual spring rates werent right, compared to the new setup i put in on the weekend, its a world of difference.

The WOF people noted some body rail damage from the one bad bottom out i had where the windscreen cracked, but that was even lower than the height in those pics (stupid actually), and on a vicious bump.. Just didnt think/pan

As a side note, i'm going to scrap those Teins so if you want me to save the locking rings (3 of them are 6 months old) youre welcome to them.

[bradc]

why not get the teins rebuilt?

[pezza]

Yup those tyres are in a real bad state... :thinking:

But having just changed your setup things may change for your next tyres?

What setup are you running now?

Hmm I still am thinking about those teins here esp after your experience. *Still not fiited* /pan

Are you going to raise the car a bit?

/edit ok just seen your other thread about the unidentified shocks :D

[mpau009]

Yup those tyres are in a real bad state... :thinking:

But having just changed your setup things may change for your next tyres?

What setup are you running now?

Hmm I still am thinking about those teins here esp after your experience. *Still not fiited* /pan

Are you going to raise the car a bit?

/edit ok just seen your other thread about the unidentified shocks :D

Those mystery shocks can actually go another 2inches lower than those pics tonight..

But no, im about happy with where it is in terms of clearance getting out of driveways / into work etc. I'll have to see what Gly:afro: can do for me to sort the remaining camber, since i cant afford to be scrubbing tyres like that.

I think the rears on my Tein setup might have been for a galant, even though it did say EC5W as well. Obviously they werent prime examples, and i bent one spring slightly on that bump, so that it rattled. They were comfortable though, kinda like stock except lower:thinking: If yours are in good nick you might as well change them. I cant imagine it would cost too much to send a few aluminium rings to the UK?

Brad: I wouldnt wish those shocks on anyone, its not until i changed them that you realise what youv been putting up with:pimp2:, and for $500 for a better 2nd hand set, itd be a pricey ordeal to rebuild.

Also i can corner on the same piece of road where i was seeing 1-2 AYC,, today 10k faster, with not even a flicker..

[Subaru ETA]

were the old coil overs leaking? i had tiens on my legnum wound bit lower than yours is and did a year on the tyres with not a sign of uneven wear and this was before i was a member so had no idea of no camber mod! mine had **** loads of camber on the rear too...id say its more a leaking coilover prblem??

[Gly]

mike,

i can get more spacers made up if needed,
but we really need to know how much camber you have on the rear,
so i can get an idea of how much more it needs

i went from -3 on the 25st to .6 with the camber mod fitted...
so it does work,

but i spent $240 in alignments in a month (80$ a time) to get it right

also your bushes may be worn...
not enough to see with your eye, but enough to screw with alignment.

[mpau009]

were the old coil overs leaking? i had teins on my legnum wound bit lower than yours is and did a year on the tyres with not a sign of uneven wear and this was before i was a member so had no idea of no camber mod! mine had **** loads of camber on the rear too...id say its more a leaking coilover prblem??

Same with my STR, which makes me wonder if its a softer tyre thing, with Potenza GII's or was it III's?:thinking: They lasted just fine.

The shocks seemed fine, but they were pretty dirty so its a bit hard to tell.

Id still like to get it to a reasonable camber, since the rear still feels looser than the fronts when you really load it up.

Be interesting to see who else has had similar experiences.

As for the tyres, they did pass them for this warrant, so i just stuck them on the fronts.

[mpau009]

mike,

i can get more spacers made up if needed,
but we really need to know how much camber you have on the rear,
so i can get an idea of how much more it needs

i went from -3 on the 25st to .6 with the camber mod fitted...
so it does work,

but i spent $240 in alignments in a month (80$ a time) to get it right

also your bushes may be worn...
not enough to see with your eye, but enough to screw with alignment.

Sounds good, i'll try and get one booked in for the weekend after queens birthday.

Honestly i dont know if the wear would be so dramatic now with the mod in place. Just thought others might like to know, and maybe consider adding some of your spacers. Also, its cool to know that OnRoad didnt have a problem with the method.

I'll let you know once iv had an alignment done. Is there any one place on the shore that is better than the rest? or are they all much of a muchness

[Subaru ETA]

stupid question...you jsut havent done something dumb like hit a curb or something?

[Gly]

i use autolign just coz i found that there printout was the easiest to read,
and they had no issues getting my lowered car on the lift.

[mpau009]

stupid question...you jsut havent done something dumb like hit a curb or something?

Anythings possible i guess, I quite often do dumb things.. But while iv had it, i havent hit anything other than bottoming out on that big bump, but i didnt notice any extra camber after that..

I cant see anything that looks scratched or bent, but as usual, i dont really know what to look for..

[bradc]

the easy solution is just to swap the rear tyres from one side to the other every 5000km :)

[BraindG]

Just a quick FYI: Prob not related (unless you changed Hubs)

I had an issue with camber pre japfest - i replaced my Hub with one that was in my garage (dereks old one) as I knackered by ABS Sensor. After fitting Dereks Hub there was a nasty camber on my passenger side wheel - initially I thought this might be to do with the tracking, however...

after removing it, and placing it side by side face down onto a flat slab of concreted it was obvious the hub was bent, I was able to move a block of wood feely under my original, but with Dereks it was no where near getting under it :(

but, you seem to have it on both sides, so not related.. unless they were replaced.

[william]

Being unidirectional you will have to strip the the tyres off the rims and refit every time!

[Louis]

I have had the same wear on tyres, but I am 99% sure it's down to the way I drive, I had all tyhe tracking and camber etc all laser checked, and a set of tyres lasted me 5 months then I was through to the fibre on the inside on the fronts.

The goodyears have quite a soft sidewall, and when you throw the car around the tyre rolls onto the sidewall and back up, they grip the road well by doing this, but you do end up with a 45degree worn angle on the inside of the tyre.

If you look at the angle you will see that the wheels would need to be really noticibly squated down (top in, bottom out) to run on the edge to give the wear.

So your set up is probably ok, do you throw the car about and get ayc bars alot? ~(i do!), hard cornering is probably the cause.

[djb160]

I've been told, but not sure how true it is, that once a tyre starts to wear on an edge say due to low pressure. That even if one corrects the initial problems the wearing effect will still continue at the accelrated rate. Anyone know if this is true or bollocks? If true, could this explain whats happened here?

[mpau009]

I do a fair bit of hard driving, matched with sitting in traffic work. I guess its just a combination of lowish pressures, sloppy suspension and pushing them round corners.

Iv had a word to Frank Allen Tyres up in Albany about swapping the tyres from one side to the other, as well as doing me a deal on a couple of alignments. Once i get a base reading at in a week or two i should know one way or the other, then i can sort out any extra camber plates.

I must say i have really noticed the softer tyre walls on the GSD3s, especially if the pressures arent just so..

[Subaru ETA]

eerrrr they are directionals so swapping side to side would be an issue!

personally i would be blaming the shocks..low pressure would be giving you "feathering" of the tyres and i didnt notice that when i looked at it

[bradc]

gsd3's aren't asymmetrical, if you remove them from one rear wheel and put them onto the other wheel facing forwards you will be wearing the edge that used to be on the outside and wasn't being worn.

[mpau009]

gsd3's aren't asymmetrical, if you remove them from one rear wheel and put them onto the other wheel facing forwards you will be wearing the edge that used to be on the outside and wasn't being worn.

Yep thats the plan:scholar:

As for the shocks being to blame, i hope so, since theyre in a heap in the corner of the garage as we speak.

I'll post the readout from the alignment once i get it looked at.

[william]

Brad, I think you are wrong. They are not asymmetrical as you point out, but they are unidirectional and you cannot just swop left and right sides without stripping off the tyre and refitting the other way around.

[bradc]

thats what I meant :) reread it 'remove them from one rear wheel and put them on the other wheel facing forwards'

[Subaru ETA]

yea im with william on this

[bradc]

^^^^^

[mpau009]

/haz /pan /pan

Dont worry Brad, i get it.

What he means is exactly what youre both saying. I will be getting the tyres taken completely off, and refitted (rolling in the same direction) on the opposite rim. And with the GSD3s there is no distinguishing between left and right, as long as it goes the right way.. not like dads Audi tyres, $700 a piece:5shots:

Hopefully they should switch the tyres for free since work is a regular customer of theirs too.

[Subaru ETA]

sorry guys ive had 5 beers!

[bradc]

out of curiosity Mike, what brand and size does his Audi run?

Dave - shhhhh then, go to sleep :P

[william]

[QUOTE=mpau009]/haz /pan /pan

Dont worry Brad, i get it.

What he means is exactly what youre both saying. I will be getting the tyres taken completely off, and refitted (rolling in the same direction) on the opposite rim.

Good one then, Mike , and sorry Brad!(I had a few glasses of red wine)

[bradc]

you're all alcoholics on here!

[Subaru ETA]

yeah it takes away the pain of seeing how much i just spent filling the car up!

[william]

Costs about the same to fill me up! ....and it lasts only 1 night.

[Subaru ETA]

haha maybe you should be filling yourself up on higher octane then :p

[bradc]

bet you couldn't drink 45 litres in one go though!

[william]

No, but my fuel is a bit more than $1.70 or so per liter!

[d i c k i e s]

hahaha... damn!

[mpau009]

:sombrero: :embarasse

Ummm yeah so.. it turns out that taking your suspension in and out 6 times in 6 months hunting for rattles, as well as fitting camber plates, CAN actually bugger your alignment./pan

Had Frank Allens do a baseline for me afterwork ($0, nice one guys). Turns out i only have between 1.5 to 2 degrees camber on the rear, and 1 degree on the fronts.

Buuuuutttt, i have "wow thats a ****load of toe" on the rear/pan

-10.9mm left and right (wheels pointing out at the front) which is basically a great big no no as far as tyre wear.

It also explains why the rear has been so loose since the rear wheels are pointing out on the corners.

I may have a go at adding some washers to the rears to even up and reduce the camber, but they werent concerned, and it apparently wont matter nearly as much as the toe.

Also, apparently its not a good idea to switch the tyres from side to side, since they are basically conical, and it can do weird things to the handling, while not really changing the wear that much..

[Gly]

told ya to get a bloodly alignment!!

no one listens to me! its just like work, LOL!

[bradc]

haha, thats a huge amount. it's a wonder your car isn't cross eyed :)

[mpau009]

told ya to get a bloodly alignment!!

no one listens to me! its just like work, LOL!

Yes, yes you did.. and No, no i did not:P

I think Kenneth did too..

I was just sceptical since i forked out after lowering the STR, and it hadnt moved at all, other than camber. But the guys at Frank Allens explained why spacing the rear arm is different from the height going up and down.

Still at least it got caught in time, "LEARNING EXPERIENCE" :pimp2:

[Subaru ETA]

wow thats a **** load of toe! might actually expain your vibration from the rear?

[mpau009]

wow thats a **** load of toe! might actually expain your vibration from the rear?

I really hope so:baby: I'll keep you posted after my proper alignment next thursday..

[Kenneth]

Yes, yes you did.. and No, no i did not:P

I think Kenneth did too..

I was just sceptical since i forked out after lowering the STR, and it hadnt moved at all, other than camber. But the guys at Frank Allens explained why spacing the rear arm is different from the height going up and down.

Still at least it got caught in time, "LEARNING EXPERIENCE" :pimp2:

Yes, its my pet rant for anyone lowering their car!!!! GET YOUR DAMN ALIGNMENT DONE FFS!

:)

[You See]

no one listens to me! its just like work, LOL!
I wish I could block out your devilish nagging!..at least I wouldn't have to "BUY BUY BUY" /Grrr

[Wodjno]

Ive not done the camber mod, but after checking my original tyres, on my old standard wheels i noticed the same thing - but, im suprised that with the camber mod its no better? :thinking:


What was the anser to this?

Did both sides have the same amount of wear?

Not read the rest of this thread yet ! But ?

I'm not entirely sure this is a Camber issue :speechles

Reason being that the above pics are exact how my original tyres on original wheels at original ride height. :thinking:

I have since lowered it around 40mm all round and changed to 18's.

Also Leggy Blondes GDi is lowered and neither of us have had any issues with tyre wear like above..

I'm pretty sure it's mainly down to wheel alignment /yes

[Gly]

if you read the from the top of this page,
he has to much toe out,

we told him to get an alignment, did he listen