Considering purchase of Legnum vr4 type s (series 2)

[Mashrock]

Hey,

I'm considering a purchace of this car, as i read through this forum i can only really find good things about this car. (which is a good thing!) but i would like to know all the negatives.. please dig up the dirt for me before i lay down the money.

i'm tossing up between a Nm35 Stagea Axis, and the later model Legnum (2000ish). there is a price difference of around 10k Australian.. (given that i beleive i can import a late model Legnum for around 15k...) where as the Axis is around 25k..

i am after a wagon, 4wd, and a possible that the car will tow a gtr.. to the track a few times a year.. and the obvious snow trips...

i know the previous series two stagea can live up to the task of towing on the odd occasion but its so F%#@% ugly..

I'm looking at going Auto, leather and whatever else..

Hope you can supply me with some info here.

Thanks

Andrew

[Turbo_Steve]

Ultimately, the Mitsi is the more stylish and more driveable car.
The Stagea is an excellent piece of machinery, but it doesn't seem to have th sporting credentials of the VR-4: softer ride, poorer handling etc etc.

However, if you're going to modify the car, I'd suggest the stagea might be the route to take: If you're after big power, you're going to need to spend a lot of money on a VR-4, and the route is by no means proven.

The Stagea is mechanically similar enough to the Skyline to make bigger power, bigger brakes and better handling a well documented route.
Indeed 600bhp is comparitively easy to attain, as are the hundreds of brake kits and PowerFC ECU replacement etc etc. In fact the only weak spot is the handling.

The VR-4 has arguably the better chassis, DEFINITELY the better handling, and IMO smoother power delivery. The AYC grips beyond belief (I swear it feels grippier than my Evo sometimes) and you get a nicer interior and exterior.

The Nissan does seem to be more economical, though, but the later VR-4s (which I have not driven) are meant to be a lot better.

Er..hope some of that helps?

Basically, if you want to have a nice family car that can attain silly bhp and fast 1/4s go for the Stagea. It's the ultimate traffic light grand prix machine.
If you want something that's pleasant to live with day to day (though with slightyly more road noise than you'd like) handles nicely driven normally or rapidly, and is plenty powerful enough to surpise the germans (M3, S4 etc) cross country then the Legnum is for you.

My experience was that the Legnum driven rapidly with Wife in the car feels like it's going quite quick, but at similar speeds the Stagea feels like you're ragging the nuts off it. By contrast, at lower speeds, the legnum starts to show it's more annoying commonalities with the Evos, whilst the Stagea becomes a normal estate car, quiet soft and relaxing.

[Mashrock]

Cheers for the info. So your saying that you cant really fault the mitsubishi?

The Legnum or stagea purchace will not get modified...much..... The Gtr steals all the money in this situation.

http://www.goo-net.com/cgi-bin/search/disp_pic2.cgi?10152022_200201.jpg
this is the model stagea i'm refering to. has a v6 2.5L single turbo.. leather auto and all the bells etc etc

http://members.optushome.com.au/mashske/gtr/pee.jpg
this is the Money pit. 550hp, 6speed gearbox, roll cage and the list goes on and on. it is also the daily driver at the moment. i.e. why i want to get something a little more comfortable

[KiwiTT]

You are asking us to dig up the dirt on a favorite cars.

I'll try

1) Turning Circle (only a problem if you need to make a lot of three-point turns that end up being four)
2) Fuel Economy (Only a problem if you are short of cash)

[Mashrock]

You are asking us to dig up the dirt on a favorite cars.

I'll try

1) Turning Circle (only a problem if you need to make a lot of three-point turns that end up being four)
2) Fuel Economy (Only a problem if you are short of cash)


i know its a bit of a tough question, but i just want to know what i am in for.

[bradc]

They sound like what you want. Just make sure you get a big trans cooler for when you're towing the GTR :)

[d i c k i e s]

Cheers for the info. So your saying that you cant really fault the mitsubishi?

The Legnum or stagea purchace will not get modified...much..... The Gtr steals all the money in this situation.

http://www.goo-net.com/cgi-bin/search/disp_pic2.cgi?10152022_200201.jpg
this is the model stagea i'm refering to. has a v6 2.5L single turbo.. leather auto and all the bells etc etc

http://members.optushome.com.au/mashske/gtr/pee.jpg
this is the Money pit. 550hp, 6speed gearbox, roll cage and the list goes on and on. it is also the daily driver at the moment. i.e. why i want to get something a little more comfortable

dont want a holden or ford?

[Turbo_Steve]

Turning Circle hasn't been too much of a problem for me.
Fuel consumption versus power output is staggering: bear in mind I've come out of a 400+bhp 3.0L Twin turbo, and I am gobsmacked by how much fuel the legnum gets through.
I have every intention of slapping a wideband on it and see what the heck is going on: it must be on boost at idle with AFRs of 6:1! :D
UK Fuel prices are a killer.

I chose the Legnum over the Stagea as it is less modifiable, better looking, more wife friendly and generally more driveable.
Plus, I'm already familiar with the "mitsubishi" way of doing things from my 4G63, so stuff like claggy lifters, overassisted power-steering and AYC aren't a big mystery to me.

If you're already familiar with the Nissan RB stuff, surely the Stagea makes more sense as you're liable to have contacts, a garage full of spares and plenty of "parts compatibility", as well as being familiar with all the bits that tend to go wrong and why.

Just at thought.

[bradc]

I didn't think the power steering was actually that bad in my car. The steering gets quite a bit heavier with wider tyres, which I personally quite like :)

[Turbo_Steve]

The Nissan was 'mildly' overassisted until I got some serious wheels on it, then it got a lot better.

All the sporty Mitsi's I've driven are far too assisted for spirited driving: it reduces the road feel. Have a go in a fast Honda...in fact even a not-so-fast Honda, and you'll find the steering is light, whilst being very revealing: you get a lot of sensation back through the steering wheel about how much grip each tyre has and where the wheels are being pulled.

By contrast, the Mitsubishi's seem to be very light and a touch uninvolving.
It all feels very capable, don't get me wrong, but half the time I feel like I could take one hand off the wheel!

The Subaru Legacy I had was very involving from a driver perspective, and I'd be keen to see the Legnum behave the same way, either by fitting a valve in a one of the fluid lines, or perhaps a clutch at the pump?

[Mashrock]

Yahoo i'm getting some good discussion here! they seem like goot cars, unlike alot of the normal "mitusbishi" problem cars thay have here in Australia.

this was my main concern. Mitsubishi has had a bad run here for many years. But it appears that this car isnt so bad after all.

coming from the nissan background, VL commodore, Gti-r, Gtr, i was keen on sticking to it. but i have always had the spot for an evo and this legnum wagon is pretty damn stylish. and a lot cheeper than the stagea nm35 which i think is pretty damn nice too. so its a pretty tough decision.

fuel consumption is sounding pretty spot on with my gtr tho. haha $95 to fill up 65L and i get roughly 250-300km's

[Sydo]

That's a pretty heavy tow load for a car that doesn't even come with a towbar..
I'm sure it will do it, but the Legnum isn't really built for towing.

[bradc]

Dunno about that, most NZ towbars are rated at 2000kg or so, and I can't see how a 4wd powerful car isn't suited for towing!

[Subaru ETA]

willim tows his boat behind his no problem! he actually got his second legnum coz he said it was such a good tow car!

[william]

That's right!

[Sydo]

Dunno about that, most NZ towbars are rated at 2000kg or so, and I can't see how a 4wd powerful car isn't suited for towing!

In theory they should be perfectly suited for towing. Grip and power!
It's just that so far, no-one has here in Australia has really had any experience even fitting a towpack!

[bradc]

William - you live! Are you coming on Saturday night to my place?

[Sydo]

fuel consumption is sounding pretty spot on with my gtr tho. haha $95 to fill up 65L and i get roughly 250-300km's

Considering what the car is - I think fuel comsumption is pretty damn good! I'm averaging 11-12 ltrs/100kms at the moment. This however does include a lot of highway cruising.

[william]

Hey Brad, very much alive but a little quiet! I will unfortunately not be able to make it on Saturday - it is my younster's birthday and I am taking him and some mates to Rainbow's End. Have fun anyway!

[Mashrock]

My mates are pretty good fabricators, when i was looking towards the stagea i asked him if he could make me up a decent tow system. i'm sure he will do the sae thing for the legnum,

i'm now really lookin towards one now. grade 4's from 98-00 are selling for 500000, compared to the stageas 1.2mil..

i've found a nice grade 4 with leather too. right up my alley..

does anyone have the leather? whats it like?

[william]

I recently converted my interior to leather and like it a lot. I seriously considered getting Recaro's but the right leather deal come up and I went for it. The leather seats are not as grippy as the Recaro's in cornering but are otherwise very comfortable and give a classy feel and look to the interior IMHO. Also very easy to clean when you get in the car with a wet bum after some watersport activities!

[Kenneth]

when you get in the car with a wet bum after some watersport activities!

:inquisiti

[Mashrock]

hahaha suspect!!

[william]

I leave that to your dirty minds! I am an upstanding member of society!

[bradc]

William - did you get black or tan leather? And remind me, did you have recaro's or normal seats before?

[william]

Black leather seats and door cards Brad. I had the leather refurbished by a chap who advertised in the Classic Car magazine and it looks good. I did not have Recaro's before and do not think I would have changed them for leather if I had them!

[bradc]

nice :) I like the black leather in my ST-R

[Mashrock]

Awesome! leather it is! just watched one sell at auction for Y450,000 Pearl, leather, 98 model, and grade 4, with 61000km. this is looking quiet good!