Warning : Replace creaky ball joints asap!!

[william]

Some of you might recall me asking a question about my creaky front suspension and that I was advised to replace the lower suspension arm asap. Well, I gave the rubber parts a squirt of WD40 which stopped the noise and kept on procrastinating about replacing the suspension arm. When the creaking returned last week I finally made a booking to have the work done next Wednesday.

Yesterday coming back from a fishing trip ( and a chilly bin full of yummy snapper) with the boat in tow the inevitable happened. As I rounded a roundabout after fortunately having to stop to give way to traffic the left front suspension collapsed bringing me to a sudden stop.

The Legnum had the usual damage to the inner wheel arch, bent front fender and lower sill and of course the suspension, including the driveshaft being pulled from the gearbox.

Being an AA member helped and I could phone for a tow to a suspension place . I hope the insurance will come to the party and get things sorted out.

I hate to think what the outcome would have been I this happened on the motorway.

[mpau009]

Yesterday coming back from a fishing trip ( and a chilly bin full of yummy snapper) with the boat in tow the inevitable happened. As I rounded a roundabout after fortunately having to stop to give way to traffic the left front suspension collapsed bringing me to a sudden stop.


Gotta say this thing is starting to worry me a bit..

I think there is at least one person a year on here who ends up with a collapsed ball joint:thinking:

Bluey ended up with her mint custom legnum in a lamp post because of it when i had first joined.

I have been thinking about replacing my wheel bearings and ball joints lately, basically because i want to be able to push my car on the track or what not without worrying if something 10 years old is going to fail. Kind of a crappy thing to spend money on, but hmmm.

Glad to hear you escaped relatively okay william. It worrys me that a car as well looked after and serviced as yours can have that happen, then i look at mine, and the number of cable ties holding things on and think :thinking:

[miller]

Starting to concern us all i think, is there a write up anywhere on how to check your own for signs of wear and tear?


Mike

[Turbo_Steve]

Can you please describe the creak? Is it going over bumps?
Ours creaks like a horror film when you use the brakes at low (<5mph) speeds (i.e. only really notice it when putting it in the garage) but is fine under all other conditions.

[Ryan]

Aaaai... sorry to hear that William but glad that the precious cargo is OK (you guys, not the snapper :) )

[william]

The tow truck operator told me he tows in heaps of Legnum /Galants and Diamantes with the same problem. When he arrived on the scene he said straight away "your ball joint collapsed"

The suspension guy Dave confirmed the common problem and said you have to jack the car up and use a longish metal bar to check for vertical play in the ball joints. That is why the problem is missed during warrant of fitness checks. I think I can remember a thread somewhere on here explaining how to check for the play.

Miller and Steve, the noise was a loud creaky sound a bit like the sound when you really tighten your wheel nuts that last bit. It was audible when you turn the steering wheel and when the suspension "dipped" when you braked.

[william]

I actually had some good luck in spite of what happened. About 5 minutes after it happened Claire and Carl, my wife and youngest son, arrived at the scene on their way back from tennis. Not 2 minutes later somebody I know arrived and towed my bout back to my house (it happened about 2km from home)

The traffic cop who came with blazing lights and wailing sirens redirected the traffic and while we waited for the tow truck which he speeded up with a phone call telling the AA about the amount of disruption my calamity was causing the traffic flow, we discovered he spent 8 years in South Africa as a school kid (in Kempton Park, the poor sod!) He offered to clear the traffic ahead of me and the tow truck so we could get the car to the suspension experts before they closed!!

The guy Dave at Steering and Balancing in New Lynn is a member at the same boat club I am a member at and promised he will make sure the car will be as good as new. He also offered to lease with the panel beaters to get the body damage sorted out as one claim.

So, I guess it could have been worse!

By the way, I am going to replace the right hand side lower suspension arm too!

Another point - I checked and my recall was done in Japan.

[richy rich]

Starting to concern us all i think, is there a write up anywhere on how to check your own for signs of wear and tear?


Mike
All you need to do is jack the car up.
Grab the wheel top and bottom and pull the top of the wheel and push the bottom at the same time. Then go the opposite way. Do this a few times and you should be able to feel any slack in the ball joints.

[bradc]

Sorry to hear about the mishap William. I've had my recall done, and the one on the drivers side replaced again. Might think about getting the passenger side on done again soon.

[william]

Thanks Brad, I have had my misgivings about my steering feeling a bit dead but thought it was due to comparing it with Claire's Alfa which has very direct feeling steering input. I think we should consider replacing the lower arms maybe every 100 00 km or so

[Subaru ETA]

jezz thats scary stuff! glad to hear you are ok.

how long ago did it go for a WOF? they have to check for ball joint play and it should have been picked up.

the guys at steering and balancing are top guys so its in good hands

[Robotnik123]

I have been hearing similar creeks from my car for a while now. Can you give more details on the test where you use a longish metal bar to check for vertical play in the ball joints? Would say Pitstop or some place like that be able to do the check.

Am thinking I might get the work done anyway for peace of mind, even if there isn't detectable play as the car is getting on in mileage now. What is the work that needs to be done, is it 'replacing the lower suspension arms'?

[Davezj]

just a general question to all how have replaced there lower ball joints.

Did you replace them with Genuine Mitsi parts or after market ones?

i have heard of a few failures of after market ones, but i do not recall hearing about genuine mitsi parts needing replacing after they have been swapped once.

Where have the lower arms failed?

the ones i have seen in pics have failed at the ball joint it's self. either the threaded part of the stud has snapped off at the ball or the ball has completely come out of it socket. i don't know of any other type of failures.

please can you tell us about your failures and what type of part failed, so we can build up a picture of what happens, including the creeking and knocks that are heard before failure.

then maybe we can fire this info back to mitsi to see if they can do another safty recall if it is mitsi parts that are failing.

as a side note. you may have had the lower arm recall done but that does not mean you have had the lower arms replaced. as when i looked that the recall and translated it it seem to state the following.
the recall states (not the exact words but the gist) that if the ball joint rubbers have split ar perished (show signs of water ingress) then the arms should be replaced but if they don't then it just the check that has been done.

and for the reason above i have diliberatly not had my recall done as the rubbers look fine on mine so when i see them perished or when i want the recall doing i will make sure the rubber are split so the arm get replaced.

[william]

Dave, the WOF was done 2 months ago. Dave, the guy at Steering and Balancing, says the play is not picked up during standard checks. I think LTSA should issue a directive to all WOF stations advising them on the correct procedure. When I see Dave again I will ask him to demo it to me and I will post it up.

Jan, I am sure Pitstop should be able to check it for you.

[Robotnik123]

Dave, the WOF was done 2 months ago. Dave, the guy at Steering and Balancing, says the play is not picked up during standard checks. I think LTSA should issue a directive to all WOF stations advising them on the correct procedure. When I see Dave again I will ask him to demo it to me and I will post it up.

Jan, I am sure Pitstop should be able to check it for you.

OK thanks. Btw, do you know if you're getting Mitsubishi original replacement arms or aftermarket ones?

[CANDEE]

The tow truck operator told me he tows in heaps of Legnum /Galants and Diamantes with the same problem. When he arrived on the scene he said straight away "your ball joint collapsed"

The suspension guy Dave confirmed the common problem and said you have to jack the car up and use a longish metal bar to check for vertical play in the ball joints. That is why the problem is missed during warrant of fitness checks. I think I can remember a thread somewhere on here explaining how to check for the play.

Miller and Steve, the noise was a loud creaky sound a bit like the sound when you really tighten your wheel nuts that last bit. It was audible when you turn the steering wheel and when the suspension "dipped" when you braked.

After watching the guys at VTNZ do the wof on my car, they do check this. Have also seen the place that I usually take my cars to use the method that Rich has outlined during a wof too....

Good to hear that you are all ok, and everything is being sorted as painlessly as possible too. :)

J

[william]

Thanks Jeremy. Obviously not everybody does that check. Jan, I have not spoken to the suspension people yet but will ask when I talk to them

[Robotnik123]

After watching the guys at VTNZ do the wof on my car, they do check this. Have also seen the place that I usually take my cars to use the method that Rich has outlined during a wof too....

Good to hear that you are all ok, and everything is being sorted as painlessly as possible too. :)

J

I've actually had this annoying creaky noise quite similar to what william describes for more than a year. And of course the car has passed a few WOFs in the mean time. Anyway, I think I will specifically have the ball joints inspected, just to be sure now.

[The Vee]

When my recall was done, they were described as being within tolerence - so ne replacements. To be fair it was still under warranty then so was not that old or much mileage. At the last warranty check I asked them to check again just to be sure - again ok but slight wear on offside but still within limits. . A little while later though I just bought a pair of arms from Mitsi and fitted them. Don't like the way they also support the weight of the car, so they have so much work to do and will wear out/seize very easily if they wash or dry out. For me, I wish we had the USDM style front suspension which is McPherson strut which at least alleviates the load bearing property of the lower swivel

[Kenneth]

Are you sure about that? Have you inspected the McPherson strut setup?

It looked pretty much the same to me with the main difference being that the shock and and spring assembly replaces the upper arm and the upright arm on the hub carrier.

I would think you can do the conversion fairly easily, I was looking at a set of these hub carriers from an 8g when I got my facelift ones.

I wouldn't go with McPherson strut setup myself as apart from the weight, it is inferior to multi-link suspension.


When my recall was done, they were described as being within tolerence - so ne replacements. To be fair it was still under warranty then so was not that old or much mileage. At the last warranty check I asked them to check again just to be sure - again ok but slight wear on offside but still within limits. . A little while later though I just bought a pair of arms from Mitsi and fitted them. Don't like the way they also support the weight of the car, so they have so much work to do and will wear out/seize very easily if they wash or dry out. For me, I wish we had the USDM style front suspension which is McPherson strut which at least alleviates the load bearing property of the lower swivel

[Robotnik123]

Am also concerned about after market lower suspension arms versus the Mitsubishi part. Would the aftermarket arms we get in NZ from BNT or someplace have the same issues as the UK ones?

[Ryan]

Just my 2c here but MMC Simon Lucas picked up the same fault when I took the car for it's first warrant after buying it.

They replaced the entire lower control arm. (think that's what it's called)

[bradc]

Just to confirm, is it the part marked 40320 or 40330?

[william]

I think it is 40320. Dave at Steering and Suspension said they checked the other side and it was OK. He seems to feel that we do not have to replace the arms routinely provided there is no play in the ball joints. So, go and have the ball joints checked and if there is play in them or if they creak, replace them! You cannot miss the creak - it is a loud noise similar to the noise when you really tighten those wheel nuts (or loosen them) The suspension should not make a noise when you turn the steering or compress it.

[Robotnik123]

I think it is 40320. Dave at Steering and Suspension said they checked the other side and it was OK. He seems to feel that we do not have to replace the arms routinely provided there is no play in the ball joints. So, go and have the ball joints checked and if there is play in them or if they creak, replace them! You cannot miss the creak - it is a loud noise similar to the noise when you really tighten those wheel nuts (or loosen them) The suspension should not make a noise when you turn the steering or compress it.

Yeah I hear a noise much like that coming from the right hand side of the car. Not when I turn the wheel though, but when I hit the accelerator and lay off it again in quick succession or sometimes on a bump in the road.

[william]

Have it checked, Jan!

[Robotnik123]

According to here and from what I can deduce from babel fish my lower arms were done in Japan. http://recall.mitsubishi-motors.co.jp/Recall/resultrecallstatus.do

The arms also have white part number stickers on them, would original factory fitted arms be stickered as such?

Anyway, am pretty sure the recall has been done. Nonetheless there is the noise I hear somwtimes. So I dunno, any advice...

[william]

My recall was also done. The white sticker on the arm means it has been checked. That does not mean, as I have found out, that it is still OK! As I said, Jan, have it checked.

[Subaru ETA]

even if they were replaced in japan it doesnt mean that they wont wear out again! my old mans ford territory (which have an identical lower arm set up to our cars) has had both sides replaced 3 times! and its only done 50,000km!

[Robotnik123]

Right, will have the car looked at this week. Was out for a drive just now and for sure it was making the clunky noise again. And it does creak when I turn the wheel too I notice.

[Rambaud]

Just my 2c here but MMC Simon Lucas picked up the same fault when I took the car for it's first warrant after buying it.

They replaced the entire lower control arm. (think that's what it's called)

Mitsi dealer fitted a "new bottom suspension joint" at the MOT in July. Cost was £152.00 + £90.00 labour - both plus VAT.

The part number was MR296295.

[Robotnik123]

What's a good place to take a car to get its balljoints checked in Wellington? I guess there's the dealer, but what about a really good suspension specialist, just to be sure.

[Turbo_Steve]

Can't get mine to make the noise under any conditions except braking....so will get a big bar on there and check for play, but otherwise assume it's the caliper pins or something.

[CANDEE]

What's a good place to take a car to get its balljoints checked in Wellington? I guess there's the dealer, but what about a really good suspension specialist, just to be sure.
Jan,

I would either use Ron @ Total Performance in Petone, or the guys @ Maclennan Performance in town(if you go into Maclennan's dont take Dixon with you... he is prone to looking at wheel with his fingers and knocking wheels of the wall.... :P).

J

[Robotnik123]

Well just heard back from the mechanic on my car. The noise I was hearing was from the rack end. So am getting them to fix that, as that's something that's been annoying me for a while, even though it is not bad enough to fail a WOF they say.

Ball joints are 100% OK too. The mechanic reckoned that the noise if it were balljoints would have been really loud. The noise in my car can't be heard with the radio on for example, but a failing balljoint creak would have been.

[william]

"You cannot miss the creak - it is a loud noise similar to the noise when you really tighten those wheel nuts (or loosen them)"


As I said!

[Robotnik123]

You cannot miss the creak - it is a loud noise similar to the noise when you really tighten those wheel nuts (or loosen them)


As I said!

Yeah that is kind of what I was hearing on my car, except I guess it wasn't quite that loud. It's been annoying me for a while though, so am glad it is going to be fixed.

[FNFAST VR4]

"You cannot miss the creak - it is a loud noise similar to the noise when you really tighten those wheel nuts (or loosen them)"


As I said!

Mine makes exactly this noise! I'm holding out til I get my bonus at work (first week of December they reckon).

I'll be driving very cautiously until they are done...

[Robotnik123]

Haha, jokes on me, the bloody noise is still there. Damn and blast! Am down $149.50. I reckon it must be the balljoint as well, just that it makes a noise, but it doesn't have any play, even if you test for excess play with a longish metail rod, as I requested done. Will get the lower arm done at my next WOF in a few months just in case. I'll have a word to the mechanic who wasted my money today as well.

[Davezj]

you might have what i have and the noise could be coming from the rack itself.

To check if it anything to do with the steering, you need to have the car stopped, drivers window open, car running. rock the steering wheel from left to right just enough to see the wheels start to move, and if there is a clunking/nocking noise then it is likely to be steering related.
Get out of the car put hand on track rod end and rock the steering wheel again and you should be able to feel better there. if you can't feel it on the track rod ends, then get someone else to rock the steering whell whilst you start putting your hands on the other linking arm to check for vibration/clunk.

I changed my rack rods and the track rod ends, before find out it was actually the rack itself clunking.

[Oblivion]

What would you expect to pay here in NZ to have one of the ball joints replaced? (Part + labour)

[bradc]

Labour isn't much, I guess most workshops would charge you for 1 hour labour, or whatever their minimum charge is.

Not sure how much an original mitsi part is.

Perhaps I could try and organise a group buy from Ralliart? I will check with them on tuesday. I will make a new thread shortly.

[Ryan]

What would you expect to pay here in NZ to have one of the ball joints replaced? (Part + labour)

I had my lower control arm replaced by MMC Simon Mucus north shore and it was in the $2xx reigion.

Mind you that was about 2 years ago.

[dickytim]

The suspension guy Dave confirmed the common problem and said you have to jack the car up and use a longish metal bar to check for vertical play in the ball joints. That is why the problem is missed during warrant of fitness checks. I think I can remember a thread somewhere on here explaining how to check for the play.
.

This checked in a warrant, and if it isn't then go elsewhere, my warrant guy found mine.

Mike I have a spare set if straight arms for both sides if you wanted to buy them off me, I paid $65 each + GST.

Let me know, you can have them for $120

[dickytim]

The suspension guy Dave confirmed the common problem and said you have to jack the car up and use a longish metal bar to check for vertical play in the ball joints. That is why the problem is missed during warrant of fitness checks. I think I can remember a thread somewhere on here explaining how to check for the play.
.

This checked in a warrant, and if it isn't then go elsewhere, my warrant guy found mine.

Mike I have a spare set if straight arms for both sides if you wanted to buy them off me, I paid $65 each + GST.

Let me know, you can have them for $120

[Oblivion]

Perhaps I could try and organise a group buy from Ralliart? I will check with them on tuesday. I will make a new thread shortly.

Keen for that, have I missed your thread? I cant seem to find it...

[bradc]

Never got around to it :) I completely forgot!

[KEENY]

Can you please describe the creak? Is it going over bumps?
Ours creaks like a horror film when you use the brakes at low (<5mph) speeds (i.e. only really notice it when putting it in the garage) but is fine under all other conditions.

sorry its to little to late but a ball joint failing sounds like this

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17146