help with this oil atf

[vr4-fan]

hi , I found in the net one oil can fit in vr4 , I need a change oil , what tkink about this oil , enter the link and read , and told me if I can put in my vr4

http://www.eneos.us/products.php?pk=9

[AlanDITD]

It mentions dexron 3 so i would say no

[Nutter_John]

Mitsubishi Motor
DIA Queen ATF II/AW Yes
DIA Queen ATF SP II/II M Yes
DIA Queen ATF SP III (AT vehicles) Yes
DIA Queen ATF SP III (CVT vehicles) NO

BUT WHY NOT USE AMSOIL !!!!!

[vr4-fan]

that is I mind say , is = sp III

[AlanDITD]

Mitsubishi Motor
DIA Queen ATF II/AW Yes
DIA Queen ATF SP II/II M Yes
DIA Queen ATF SP III (AT vehicles) Yes
DIA Queen ATF SP III (CVT vehicles) NO

BUT WHY NOT USE AMSOIL !!!!!


Personally its to expensive, i bought 4 litres of SP3 the other day for 18.50 thats four AYC changes roughy. Amsoil is what 65quid for the same four changes?

I can do 16 changes for the same price of four, and yeah ill have to do it more often but not more times four.

My 2p anyway

[elnevio]

Fair point Alan!

However, we are talking about the gearbox here (well, I assume so, seeing as our man here keeps getting badgered to change the ATF in his gearbox! :p).

Given the choice of using a well-known, well-proven ATF, which is widely acknowledged to be the best ATF available for our complex gearboxes, and spending an extra £100 for the privilege of having it, I would spend the extra cash now without question.

And that's without taking into account that the Amsoil ATF is actually likely to last longer than ordinary SP-III, and can take more abuse, as it has a wider operating temperature range, as well as a good concoction of detergents to keep the gearbox nice and shiny (where appropriate!!) on the inside!

[Turbo_Steve]

Also, I believe VR4fan needs some gearbox oil in a hurry - and can't get amsoil from a local supplier in his country.

[Nutter_John]

yep thats assuming you have to change the amsoil as often as you suggest

anyway back on track

[elnevio]

The Eneos stuff may well be the best available in the Dominican Republic - and it DOES after all state that it meets the SP-III specification for auto gearboxes.

[AlanDITD]

Fair point Alan!

However, we are talking about the gearbox here (well, I assume so, seeing as our man here keeps getting badgered to change the ATF in his gearbox! :p).

Given the choice of using a well-known, well-proven ATF, which is widely acknowledged to be the best ATF available for our complex gearboxes, and spending an extra £100 for the privilege of having it, I would spend the extra cash now without question.

And that's without taking into account that the Amsoil ATF is actually likely to last longer than ordinary SP-III, and can take more abuse, as it has a wider operating temperature range, as well as a good concoction of detergents to keep the gearbox nice and shiny (where appropriate!!) on the inside!


Yeah i do understand amsoil is a better product and im not disputing that at all. But my main concern is why would i ever buy a car with mitsubishi full service history when infact there product isnt long lasting or actually that good? Doesnt that just not make sense?

The same maths applys to the gear box 15L of amsoil is about 220quid and mitsu SP3 is around 65, again its three times the cost. And yes the oil does deteriorate faster "if" the operating temps get to high, thats how i understood it anyway.

Am i really missing somthing about amsoil? Because to me to it just seems way over the top cost wise. I can fit a Gearbox oil cooler for 50quid that will last me the life of the car, and help mantain the life of the oil and the gearbox. And I dont plan to ever track the car. But why just fit a cooler for that reason. If it wont get to hot on normall driving then whats worng with the mitsu stuff?

From what i read the gearbox oil is good for waaayy more than 4.5k but every 10degrees or so it gets over optimum operating temp the oil life is halved.

Just to add im not slating amsoil at all i just dont get the point of all the expense.

I am here to be educated :D

[vr4-fan]

The Eneos stuff may well be the best available in the Dominican Republic - and it DOES after all state that it meets the SP-III specification for auto gearboxes.


so,, I can use this oil?? or not?


the amsoil ist extremely expensive , and ship to this contry too :( I need others choice , and I found this oil , so , I waht to know what all you think

[Turbo_Steve]

Nobody knows for sure, here, but the general agreement is that it SAYS it will do the job. It's definitely worth trying.

As the fluid in your gearbox sounds like it's really bad, it may be worth using this stuff to flush it through, drive it for a bit (maybe a week) and then do another complete change.

I know that sounds expensive, but if the fluid that comes out is brown, then a full flush will make it red...however letting it run for a week is likely to flush more brown out into the system.

If you plan on a week and another change, if the Eneos stuff is not good (i.e. too much slip, jerky changes etc) you can stick Amsoil in instead, the problem should go and you can leave it in for miles and miles and miles.

[Kieran]

so,, I can use this oil?? or not?


the amsoil ist extremely expensive , and ship to this contry too :( I need others choice , and I found this oil , so , I waht to know what all you think

Eneos is one of Japan's top motor oil brands.

If it says that it meets Mitsubishi SP-II and SP-III standards, it will. They're not a 'cheap' oil brand.

So you can use it without a problem. :thumbsup:

[Turbo_Steve]

Kieran: Master of Japanesque.

[vr4-fan]

Kieran: Master of Japanesque.


thats means , I can use this oil?

[elnevio]

thats means , I can use this oil?
/yes

Yes, you can use that oil.

[crazydriver81]

Yes, you can. As long as the ATF meets the Mitsubishi Diamond SP-III standard for AT-gearboxes it should be fine. Go ahead and change the fluid before it kills your gearbox.

Stefan

[Turbo_Steve]

Nobody knows for sure, here, but the general agreement is that it SAYS it will do the job. :laugh:

[vr4-fan]

some friend told me that , if I change all oil , can be kill the transmision , because , its not recomendend change all oil in the tranny ,that its truue , or not problem ???

[elnevio]

Change ALL the oil in the transmission. Your friend is wrong.

[vr4-fan]

Change ALL the oil in the transmission. Your friend is wrong.

thnaks :) I going to change this oil urgently , ist look brown , it too bad ,

[Turbo_Steve]

Definitely do one change, and another shortly afterwards, then. Doing a single change is unlikely to shift all the poo in the gearbox, so nice fresh oil, a few hundred miles, and another change, is probably the best way to preserve it's life.


Does your gearbox have an oil filter on top?

[crazydriver81]

@ vr-4 fan:
It's the way round. If you don't change, then it will definitely kill your gearbox.

Mitsi recommends to change the ATF at least every 45000 kms, some of the guys here do it more often. I personally use AMSOIL ATF and change the ATF once a year.

[vr4-fan]

@ vr-4 fan:
It's the way round. If you don't change, then it will definitely kill your gearbox.

Mitsi recommends to change the ATF at least every 45000 kms, some of the guys here do it more often. I personally use AMSOIL ATF and change the ATF once a year.


NO!!

i TRY WITH EONOS

[Subaru ETA]

no? so you are not going to change you ATF? so confused....

[amsoil]

We seriously looked at becoming a distributor for Nippon Oiks at the Car show at the back end of 2007. We were looking at supplying barrels to the trade but they had no network and great plans which relied on us or someone else doing all the hard work. It is not a bad product, but is isn't in the league of the better Castrol /Mobil etc perhaps like Comma but better than Planet of course. Problem was that it was prices higher than I believe it should have been and would be problematical to sell having few redeeming features bar that its the number 1 oil in Japan; (what does this prove)
If you can get it easily in the Dominican Republic then use it. And as above change all the ATF , not just the cheapo way by just dumping the contents of the sump.
Amsoil engine oil does not deteriorate with temperature until over about 170 degrees C good luck with everything else if you manage to achieve this!

[amsoil]

The same maths applys to the gear box 15L of amsoil is about 220quid and mitsu SP3 is around 65, again its three times the cost. And yes the oil does deteriorate faster "if" the operating temps get to high, thats how i understood it anyway.

Just to add im not slating amsoil at all i just dont get the point of all the expense.

I am here to be educated :D

Amsoil ATF is expensive, Amsoil ATF is the best; not just saying that I do not believe there is a better alternative.
Cost would be £165 for 15L delivered. (still expensive but not the £220 stated)
Amsoil ATF will actually take 100 degrees more before it starts to be affected by temperature like other ATFs. Bottom line is that you are exccedingly unlikely to break it. Being a detergent based synthetic ATF it also cleans everything and keeps it that way. There is a reason why some Japanese car main dealers buy it when they have a 'problem gearbox' Doesn't say too much about what they usually use does it :scholar:

[I-S]

Yeah i do understand amsoil is a better product and im not disputing that at all. But my main concern is why would i ever buy a car with mitsubishi full service history when infact there product isnt long lasting or actually that good? Doesnt that just not make sense?

Mitsubishi dealers in the UK apparently have no clue how to change the oil anyway, regardless of whether their product is any good or not. So, when it comes to the transmission (and in my experience, other things too), having an FMSH is nothing to write home about...

[crazydriver81]

Just one comment to the Mitsi garages and changing ATF. Don't judge them too early.

A friend of mine owns a Mitsi garage. We looked into the servicing schedule for a european spec Galant with AT and Tip (also Invecs II) and there it is stated to use SPII oil. Maybe this could be because they never had a AWD model in Europe with TipAuto...

Additionally the workshop manual says to pull the oil from the sump and refill (+filter change). There is nothing said about pulling the oil from valve body and torque converter. So you have to ask the guys in Japan why they have put down such a service schedule...

Stefan

[amsoil]

I hate to say but I really supect that the Japanese are only interested in cars lasting 5 years. IMHO of course

[vr4-fan]

other thinks is when the car the temp is 1/2 , sometimes turn on the AYC red i dont understant that

[elnevio]

other thinks is when the car the temp is 1/2 , sometimes turn on the AYC red i dont understant that
Sounds like you need a new AYC pressure switch - send a message to MPBVR4 - he might be able to hook you up with a new one. :thumbsup:

[Turbo_Steve]

I really supect that the Japanese are only interested in cars lasting 5 years

Agree with this, at least partially: I suspect it's more the case that they don't want the costs of servicing for the first 5 years or more to be above a specific threshold as decided by the marketing department. As such, someone will have worked out the cost of regular full flushes with 15L of ATF, shaken their heads and asked one of the engineers what the bare minimum would be to keep the gearbox going with some "light abuse".

15L of Amsoil ain't exactly the cheapest comonent on the car - essential, yes, and I am not complaining, but you can see why it might impact sales of the car if the service was too expensive.

[Kieran]

Just one comment to the Mitsi garages and changing ATF. Don't judge them too early.

A friend of mine owns a Mitsi garage. We looked into the servicing schedule for a european spec Galant with AT and Tip (also Invecs II) and there it is stated to use SPII oil. Maybe this could be because they never had a AWD model in Europe with TipAuto...

Additionally the workshop manual says to pull the oil from the sump and refill (+filter change). There is nothing said about pulling the oil from valve body and torque converter. So you have to ask the guys in Japan why they have put down such a service schedule...

Stefan

That's interesting. I checked the UK manuals and they too state to use SP-II (which is correct, that was what was in them originally).

The UK manuals also *clearly* state (Page 23-47) to pump out the valve body and torque converter by disconnecting the cooler line. Now in Isaac and my own experience with my 8G GLS they don't do this. I took my car to Chris Variava Mitsubishi in Notts and not only did they just drop the contents of the sump, but they also used Dexron III to refill it.

I got on well with the service manager and I queried this. I found out that they [Mitsubishi Notts] sourced their Lubricants from Morris Oils. Now Morris are a decent make AFAIK but at the time (2003/2004) they didn't produce a SP-II/III ATF. The reason for use was that it was cheaper and more readily available than SP-II, and also that "It was just as good a fluid anyway".:inquisiti

And that was one of several reasons why their mechanics only ever did one job on my Legnum. /pan

[Stagman]

Chaps, has anyone tried Dexron VI?

[Kieran]

Chaps, has anyone tried Dexron VI?

Welcome to Cvr4 Stagman. :)

I'd say probably not - Mainly because again it's a different spec and these boxes are really fussy about what fluid is in them.

[Kieran]

Hmmm, having read a little info it seems that GM introduced Dexron 6 as some of their autoboxes now have the clutchpack friction materials in direct contact with each other.

I note that not many branded ATFs (Even the 'multi' atfs) claim compatibility with both standards as yet, though wether that's because they aren't close enough in terms of fluid properties or because D6 is still new is anyone's guess. I also note that GM now states that D6 is backwards compatible with boxes originally filled with Dexron-III. That alone suggests to me that it's perhaps not close enough to be useful.

[Stagman]

Many thanks for both the welcome and reply. Yes, searching myself on the internet it seems that although the performance in respect of thermal stability, low temperature performance and longevity is close (and in some respects better) than Amsoil, it's difficult to make good judgment as there is so much negative historical discussion about Dexron III, and I doubt whether the manufacturers of modern fluids are really concerned with producing a fluid to satisfy the requirements of an obsolete item.

Interestingly, Halfords currently sell 3 fully-synthetic engine oils, (all 5W-30) but independently satisfying GM, BMW/Mercedes and lastly WV, are we to think that these are non-cross compatible, and what the consequences may be if the wrong one were to be used? So confusing!!!

[vr4-fan]

well , I buy 6 quart to EONEOS ATF for my change , i hope do the job , because i need a atf oil very fast , !!!!

[bradc]

You need 10-12 quarts

[Turbo_Steve]

I think the key difference is that with engine oils the requirements are much simpler than those of a diff or gearbox: some viscosity creep or a small varience in thermal transfer is less likely to have an impact, whereas our AYC and INVECSII both require extremely precise viscosity, friction and thermal properties. In fact, what we've seen is that if the gearbox is really pushed (i.e. no auxilliary cooling on track etc) then the fluids actually can't cope with the thermal load and break down, turning into sludge which then stops cooling and lubrication and seems to cause gearbox failure.

Whilst engine oil is essential for lubricating, cooling and cleaning the engine, it has to fulfill those functions in pretty much that order: as it's properties change, it is still liable to perform most of those functions, though obviously it will be able to do it less and less as it degrades.

[Kieran]

well , I buy 6 quart to EONEOS ATF for my change , i hope do the job , because i need a atf oil very fast , !!!!

6 quarts will allow you to change the ATF in the sump, which is better than nothing, however as Brad says, to do a full flush you need between 10 and 12. :)

[arcstrike]

where do you get this amisoil from just changed the rad on mine now want too drop the atf out and have new.dont want to buy a new box shudder to think how many beer tokens that will cost.so expensive atf is better than gearbox

[peter thomson]

Most of us by our oil fron Don here

http://www.performanceoilsltd.co.uk/

and the discount code is in the members section

[arcstrike]

thanks peter