Help : Leaking ATF

[Piers1989]

For the last couple of days ive noticed very small marks on the ground under my car after its been parked. I toucked the liquid a few times and though it was jsut a false alarm and just water with a bit of mud etc dissolved in it, but noticed it again this morning and found there to be a red tinge to it. I checked the fluids under the bonnet, oil was fine, the ATF dipstick thing had a light covering all over it and after drying and replacing came out the same way.

I looked under my car and found theres a small protective piece of metal going parralel with the car to protect the driveshaft from bumps. Just behind this, maybe an inch or 2 from where it begins at the front of the car, I noticed a very small drip coming from what I assume is the bottom of the gearbox. I poked it with a piece of reciept paper and it is the light red fluid (i believe ATF).

The cars booked into the garage on thursday to have its service finished off, and theres no warning lights on at all when driving and the fluid loss is very minimal, but I wanted to ask if anyone here might know exactly what it was teh was leaking and how a garage might fix it.

Thanks

[SGHOM]

Sounds like the dreaded TC seal failure again !! /Grrr

[Piers1989]

Sounds like the dreaded TC seal failure again !! /Grrr

I had a quick forum search for TC Seal and couldnt find any reference to a problem like this specifically, could you explain further?

[Kieran]

The shaft that the torque converter sits on has a seal around it where it enters the gearbox casing. It's very, very common for these to leak.

The seal is about £10 but you have to split the box to get at it!

[SGHOM]

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9800&highlight=gearboxes

one of hundreds of posts regarding the gearbox. :scholar:

[Piers1989]

Okay So it requires teh gearbox removing to replace the seal - providing it is the box not some part of the drivetrain leaking right. At the amount its dripping it would be alot cheaper for me just to top it up every now and again or try and seal from outside with hot glue or something similar.

If its not the gearbox im assuming topping up the fulid wont be as simple as pouring more in?

[peter thomson]

The seal can fail completly though and allow a substanial amount of oil to be lost and the first thing you will know about that is when the N light starts flashing and by that time gearbox may be damaged. You are best to get this changed as soon as possible

[Piers1989]

Here are two pictures of the leak from the side its leaking from.

http://i513.photobucket.com/albums/t333/piers1989/IMAGE_114.jpg

http://i513.photobucket.com/albums/t333/piers1989/IMAGE_115.jpg

And this is a picture of whatever it is thats leaking fron the otehr side of the front of the car.

http://i513.photobucket.com/albums/t333/piers1989/IMAGE_116.jpg

Is that the gearbox?

[peter thomson]

Classic TC seal leak in those pics .The third one is the gearbox valve cover but that may just be oil from the TC but if not the cover can be easily removed and resealed with RTV

[Piers1989]

Thanks for the information. Ill get some oil for it and top up now and get my garage to have a look on thursday and see if theyll be able to replace the seal.

[Ryan]

Just thought I'd add to this:

It's obvious you have a fubar TC seal from those pictures but be careful when adding more ATF to the system as you don't want to overfill it! :stop:

To get a more accurate reading, park the car on a level surface and with the engine running and the handbrake engaged, adopt the following shift pattern and hold each shift for say... 2 seconds:

From P into R -> Then R into N -> Then D and across into Tip mode, hold and then flick tip to + which will select 2.. hold

Back into 1, hold and then repeat back up to P. Keep the engine running and then go and see how much ATF is on the dipstick.

The reason we do this is to circulate as much ATF through the transmission and torque converter etc in order to give you a more accurate reading.

[Piers1989]

I checked teh dipstick and tehre was nothing on it. I added 1 litre and ther was still nothing on it. Noticed more flowing out. Added another leitr noticed still nothing on it. The cars now parked outside my garage.

[Nutter_John]

From what you have said and the amount of fuild you seem to be losing I would not drive the car in it's current state as you chance really fecking the gearbox up

These gearboxes as sensitive enough but to drive with fuild not on the dipstick is like playing russian roulette !!!

[richy rich]

From what you have said and the amount of fuild you seem to be losing I would not drive the car in it's current state as you chance really fecking the gearbox up

These gearboxes as sensitive enough but to drive with fuild not on the dipstick is like playing russian roulette !!!
I second that.

[Subaru ETA]

third that...id be getting it on a transporter to the workshop

[Davezj]

sounds like it may be too late to be careful. i am not saying it is terminal, but you would have to be lucky to get out of this one without some replacement parts.

3L in and it is not on the end of the dip stick that is not good at all. get it sorted as soon as possible.

please ensure you are putting the dip stick in the hole correctly sound stupid easy to do but it can be done wrongly. a lot of the A/T dip sticks are broken and when you check the fluid level there should be a notch on the white plastic suround of the dip stick which i believe is the correct point to check the level at and not pushed in all the way in with the metal stud sliding up the slot of the white plastic.
if that makes any sense to you.
but when you think about it if you are pushing it in too far and still not seeing any fluid then OH DEAR!
get it look at by someone who has done this job before and knows what they are doing, ass it can be a lot cheaper as they will not spend a lot of time doing unecessary stuff and diagnosing before getting on with the job in hand. and depending where you are located, there are a few people on here that can do the job and at the proper price. if anything need replacing then they can probably be able to source spare parts at a fraction of what mitsi will change you.
I will let them talk to you about this stuff.
GOOD LUCK!!!!

[Piers1989]

The cars been outside the garage since yesterday and i havent been driving hard since i noticed it leaking. If my garage doesnt think they can feasibly fix it ill get RAC to take it to one of the places mentioned on the earlier linked thread.

Thanks for your help.

[Piers1989]

My cars booked in at a local Audi specialist in Ulverston who has a gearbox specialist. They will charge £31/hour + ATF + seal.

On the basis of 10 hour job they recokn about £360.

[elnevio]

That only leave £50 for the seal and ATF!

Don't let them put any old Dexron III ATF in there!!

You need Mitsi's SPIII as a minimum. Amsoil ATF rules though.

[Nutter_John]

tbh Nev i have seen a invoice from this job done by Mitsi and they only claimed 5 litres was used so it could fit in

[elnevio]

I was thinking that you'd have to drop all the ATF out - do you not then?

How much ATF do you normally need to change the TC seal?

[Piers1989]

Just been to the garage to see my car with lack of gearbox :)

Theyre mid way through doing it as i type and say the box and T/C look fine and undamaged.

But, they have said there is a second seal, i believe an O-ring, that COULD be the cause / second cause of the leak.

How likley is this and if it is, where, how cheaply, and how quickly can i get one?

[Nutter_John]

depends which seal it is and how common they are

[peter thomson]

If it's the o ring between the gearbox and transfer box the dealer should have it as we replaced it as well when the TC seal was changed