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kc427
04-05-2009, 03:40 PM
OK, done!! I have successfully flashed the VR4 ECU:2thumbsup. YES, my 98 VR4 MT ECU can be flashed without problem, and I can drive it without any problem.

Here is the config:

Software: ECUFlash 1.41.2483
OS: Windows XP
Cable: OpenPort 2.0 cable
ROM ID: 20030011


Simple test has been done, ie, set the RPM Limit to 3000rpm, and flashed the ROM, and test drove the car and then really cut at around 3000rpm :rolleyes3:rolleyes3


VR4 ---- Happy Tuning /rally

Wodjno
04-05-2009, 03:51 PM
Thats excellent news.. Awesome /yes

Have some Rep :D

gallvr4
04-05-2009, 03:55 PM
:inquisiti what do you mean by "flashed"...?????

kc427
04-05-2009, 04:06 PM
So far, I found there are 5 different type of ECU that VR4 used with the following ID:

ROM ID:
20030010
20030011
20030013

23810003
23810004

Seems that the xml files are a bit messy for the VR4, so, I group information all together from different forum, and try to make the xml filename more "official" similar to EVO files.

If you have the "vr4_MD340288.xml" and "vr4_MD340289.xml", you can delete them, and download the following files instead.

Sorry, due to the file size limitation, please rename the definition file from .xml.txt to .xml, and simply unzip the "vr4base1.zip".

Wodjno
04-05-2009, 04:06 PM
:inquisiti what do you mean by "flashed"...?????

Search is your friend /yes
Try Googling /pan

kc427
04-05-2009, 04:22 PM
Note: Please keep in mind, currently, if the CPU is 7203F, the ECU cannot be flashed at the moment.

BTW, I will try to find the 2byte load for the car, if success, I will post the address :happy:

foxdie
04-05-2009, 04:28 PM
Here's some rep too :)

Louis
04-05-2009, 07:37 PM
Well done, good for you, let us know how you get on with different parameters, cheers

AlanDITD
04-05-2009, 07:50 PM
Congrats,

So ok when you can do this on the pre 98 ECU, how do we acutally go about flashing it?

Some instructions of what to do with the files and various things would be great.

Cheers

Davezj
04-05-2009, 07:53 PM
OK, done!! I have successfully flashed the VR4 ECU:2thumbsup. YES, my 98 VR4 MT ECU can be flashed without problem, and I can drive it without any problem.

Here is the config:

Software: ECUFlash 1.41.2483
OS: Windows XP
Cable: OpenPort 2.0 cable
ROM ID: 20030011


Simple test has been done, ie, set the RPM Limit to 3000rpm, and flashed the ROM, and test drove the car and then really cut at around 3000rpm :rolleyes3:rolleyes3


VR4 ---- Happy Tuning /rally

Hi there,
Can you go into a bit more detail about which processor is in the ECU that you have managed to flash. is there any reason why an Auto engine ECU can not be flashed.
Please put all the info down, like which ECU part numbers can be flashed. or let us know which processor can be flashed. and which configuration it is used in, as you have done with the Manual Trans ECU in your 98 VR4 is it a facelift.

Thanks in Advance

miller
04-05-2009, 09:30 PM
oooh excellent! have some rep! like the guys said i too would like some more info on how to flash mine? or maybe its something BenH could help with?


Mike

Turbo_Steve
05-05-2009, 12:55 AM
Not wishing to nit pick, but have you disconnected the battery and reconnected it?
I believe the ECU will store changed parameters until power loss, but then resets itself. If it will keep it's parameters past a battery disconnect....we're in business!!!! :D :D :D :D

scientist
05-05-2009, 01:02 AM
Not wishing to nit pick, but have you disconnected the battery and reconnected it?
I believe the ECU will store changed parameters until power loss, but then resets itself. If it will keep it's parameters past a battery disconnect....we're in business!!!! :D :D :D :D
THe ecu cannot restore factory settings after being flashed. Stop with that misconception. That is the advantage and disadvantage of flashing. It doesn't loose the settings.

kc427
05-05-2009, 03:07 AM
OK, what you need is, of course, a PC computer, with Windows XP(recommended). If you have Vista, I don't know there will be any compatibility issue or not with the flash tool.

Anyway, first, you need a OpenPort 2.0 cable, search from internet, or simply buy from Here (http://tactrix.com/). Remember, 1.3 cable cannot flash the ECU.

Next, the software tool you need is, ECUFlash 1.41 or later, and you can download it for free, simply Click Here (http://www.openecu.org/index.php?title=EcuFlash). After you install it, you need the definition file for the ROM, just download all the XML files I attached before, and then put into the folder inside ECUFlash.

For the ECUFlash usage, you can search around from internet, and you can find a lot of information.

Caution: Unless you know what you are doing, otherwise, you may blow your engine if you tune the ECU incorrectly.

kc427
05-05-2009, 03:15 AM
Hi there,
Can you go into a bit more detail about which processor is in the ECU that you have managed to flash. is there any reason why an Auto engine ECU can not be flashed.
Please put all the info down, like which ECU part numbers can be flashed. or let us know which processor can be flashed. and which configuration it is used in, as you have done with the Manual Trans ECU in your 98 VR4 is it a facelift.

Thanks in Advance

As far as I know, the 7202 processor can be flashed, but not the 7203. Also, some pre-facelift has 7201, and I heard that it cannot be flashed too. It is hard to know it is flashable or not by the ECU number, eg, MD340288 has metal case and plastic case, and I guess, the processor may not be the same.

By the way, my ECU is MD340288 plastic case.

Kenneth
05-05-2009, 03:19 AM
That appears to be correct. I cannot re-flash any of the 3 MH7203 processors I have from 1999,2001 and 2002 cars :|

kc427
05-05-2009, 03:20 AM
THe ecu cannot restore factory settings after being flashed. Stop with that misconception. That is the advantage and disadvantage of flashing. It doesn't loose the settings.

You are right, from the program point of view, these settings are constant, and will be used whenever program instruction needs to. Imagine, there is a box, so, whenever you walk pass the box, you open the box, and check the number inside or read the number inside the box, and then you close it and keep walking. So, whatever you put inside the box, you will get what you put. :happy:

kc427
05-05-2009, 03:26 AM
That appears to be correct. I cannot re-flash any of the 3 MH7202 processors I have from 1999,2001 and 2002 cars :|

Cannot reflash? :thinking:

Kenneth
05-05-2009, 03:35 AM
Cannot reflash? :thinking:

Sorry, my typo... they were all MH7203 processors. Have edited my post.

kc427
05-05-2009, 04:00 AM
Sorry, my typo... they were all MH7203 processors. Have edited my post.

Yes, I have searched from internet, the 7203 cannot be flashed yet. 7203 is also used on EVO 6 TME.

BTW, do you know what ID is it for the 7203? Is it 23810003 or 23810004? As I know, these 2 ID is from late model of FL, ie, 2001. I don't know the ECU number, maybe it is start with MR578xxx. Do you have the ECU number for your 3 MH7203? Maybe it's helpful for other members to identify they can flash their VR4 or not by see the ECU number first.:happy:

zentac
05-05-2009, 08:59 AM
Guys, all the technical information and the guys that have created the xml files to allow us to do this are on geek mapped

http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/showthread.php?t=276&page=5

Wodjno
05-05-2009, 09:22 AM
Just reading thru some of the files.. Not that i can make head nor tail of them ..

But am i correct in thinking that our engine in standard form is good for 9000rpm ?

Or at least to raise 500-1000rpm higher than the current limit..
I see a few references to 9000rpm rev limit..
Obviously other parameters would need modifying as well .. BUT !!

orionn2o
05-05-2009, 09:53 AM
Great work there.

I'd be interested to see the data .

Is it just me or is the zip file corrupted?? Can you please reattach it?

Cheers

Matt

kc427
05-05-2009, 09:56 AM
Just reading thru some of the files.. Not that i can make head nor tail of them ..

But am i correct in thinking that our engine in standard form is good for 9000rpm ?

Or at least to raise 500-1000rpm higher than the current limit..
I see a few references to 9000rpm rev limit..
Obviously other parameters would need modifying as well .. BUT !!

In fact, I still think some of the map address are incorrect. But, the fuel and ignition map, should be fine.

Also, the stock rpm limit is at 7296, even with it, I am still happy with it, as I have seen some other VR4 members dyno graph from different forums, it seems that after 6500rpm both torque and HP curves go down, so, even I shift at 7000rpm, I am still ok on it. :happy:

kc427
05-05-2009, 09:59 AM
Great work there.

I'd be interested to see the data .

Is it just me or is the zip file corrupted?? Can you please reattach it?

Cheers

Matt

Just tried the zip file, and it is fine, just simply unzip it as usual.

kc427
05-05-2009, 10:11 AM
Guys, all the technical information and the guys that have created the xml files to allow us to do this are on geek mapped

http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/showthread.php?t=276&page=5


Good! Thanks, and here is another link for basic usage of the ECUFlash from geekmapped:

How to: Reading from an Mitsubishi ECU using Ecuflash (http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68)

orionn2o
05-05-2009, 10:16 AM
Just tried the zip file, and it is fine, just simply unzip it as usual.

grrr doesnt work for me!

if i pm you, could you mail it to me please?

kc427
05-05-2009, 10:19 AM
grrr doesnt work for me!

if i pm you, could you mail it to me please?

sure, no problem:happy:

Dom B
05-05-2009, 11:31 AM
What we need to do is to pool our knowledge of the the ECUs and get a definitive list of what ecu's can be remapped/flashed and which cant and what cars or what years had which ecu.

I have no idea how to help, but am more than willing to take my dash apart to get any numbers off my ECU. Maybe if we set up a mini database of the ecu details against our car details that would be a start. Not sure if that is of any help though.

Nutter_John
05-05-2009, 11:36 AM
Hotwire

Wodjno
05-05-2009, 11:45 AM
Hotwire

:inquisiti

And no i'm not searching for Hotwire /pan

I know what Hotwire is !

But i d/pan o/pan n't like Cyptic Quizzes :thinking:

Nutter_John
05-05-2009, 11:48 AM
hotwire is a user on this forum and he collated a list of ecu's and there cpu#s

Wodjno
05-05-2009, 11:57 AM
hotwire is a user on this forum and he collated a list of ecu's and there cpu#s

So why didn't say that you Cryptic Corruptic /pan

Nutter_John
05-05-2009, 11:59 AM
So why didn't say that you Cryptic Corruptic /pan

pot calling kettle /pan /pan/pan/pan/pan/pan/pan/pan/pan/pan:inquisiti:scholar:

dublee
05-05-2009, 12:42 PM
Hey guys,

Small world, the BarryC who started the thread on geekmapped (http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/sho...p?t=276&page=5) is talking about MY VR4 (http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showpost.php?p=413187&postcount=53), that is where he got the def file in the first place.:thumbsup:

BarryC the GENIUS responsible for all this, anybody wishing to contact or thank him can do so via The Irish Mitsubishi Owners Club (http://www.irishmoc.org/). In the section for CW Performance.

Correct me if i'm wrong.

Wodjno
05-05-2009, 12:47 PM
Hey guys,

Small world, the BarryC who started the thread on geekmapped (http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/sho...p?t=276&page=5) is talking about MY VR4 (http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showpost.php?p=413187&postcount=53), that is where he got the def file in the first place.:thumbsup:

yeah I know.. /yes

Already sussed that 1 out :D

kc427
05-05-2009, 02:55 PM
Hey guys,

Small world, the BarryC who started the thread on geekmapped (http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/sho...p?t=276&page=5) is talking about MY VR4 (http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showpost.php?p=413187&postcount=53), that is where he got the def file in the first place.:thumbsup:

BarryC the GENIUS responsible for all this, anybody wishing to contact or thank him can do so via The Irish Mitsubishi Owners Club (http://www.irishmoc.org/). In the section for CW Performance.

Correct me if i'm wrong.

oh..the def file for VR4 was firstly seen in ClubVR4 (http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36921) in early Jan already....:beerchug::beerchug:

Anyway, let's work together, and dig out more maps ^_^

Beastlee
05-05-2009, 04:41 PM
So is this better than using a piggyback? I thought the ECUs were only good for a limited number of flashes then they have burnt out and cannot be reflashed...

My ECU is MD340289 from a Sept 1996 car and it's an A/T box. I have the E-Manage blue but a combination of ECU modification and piggyback data I think may be useful.

PaddyB
05-05-2009, 04:58 PM
So is this better than using a piggyback? I thought the ECUs were only good for a limited number of flashes then they have burnt out and cannot be reflashed...

My ECU is MD340289 from a Sept 1996 car and it's an A/T box. I have the E-Manage blue but a combination of ECU modification and piggyback data I think may be useful.

All flash devices have a finite number of erase-write cycles - the worry is that the manufacturer may have gone with something really poorly spec'd so your limited with how many times this can be done. I've tried to find teh data sheet for the ECU processor but it doesn't appear to exist in web-land so who knows how many reflashes it will give.

BTW: well done to those who've managed this - I'm really excited at what this may mean

Turbo_Steve
05-05-2009, 05:33 PM
Flashes are typically in the hundreds...if not the thousands. Never seen less than that.


THe ecu cannot restore factory settings after being flashed. Stop with that misconception. That is the advantage and disadvantage of flashing. It doesn't loose the settings.

My understanding is that we've been able to reduce the RPM and boost limits with a MUT tool for some time......but it would dissapear with an ECU reset. Correct me if this is wrong? Whilst this isn't a full flash (obviously) the only info we had (until I saw the geekmapped thread) is that KC had changed these parameters. Changing a couple of addresses in memory (a contiguous address space) and then uploading it again isn't neccesarily a flash if you're writing into volatile memory. Hence my doubts. You reset the volatile memory, you lose the change (as per the MUT tool) so I wasn't sure if the same address the MUT used was being writted. As it appears a whole map has been written and tested, I am williing to accept that a full reflash has taken place.


If the parameters in the factory ECU are sufficiently well understood, it is MUCH better than a piggyback: you're not just changing the basic fuel & ignition maps, but can also alter cold start, barometric compensation, target AFRs, boost control, knock compensation targets / correction map, aircon compensation, fan compensation, probably fan temperature, rev limiter, MAF scale, fuel cut, and as the code is better understood complete software replacements are possible, offering just about anything: ALG, switchable maps, external device triggering, CEL reconfiguration, and loads more.

Not looked at this yet as it doesn't apply to my ECU, but I am guessing we're only looking at fuel and ignition definitions at the moment?

rees
05-05-2009, 07:15 PM
so are you sayin this is a better route to go rather than say a amp ecu 2 ?

obviously a hell ove a loyt cheaper but does the mapecu2 option have any advantages , eg live real time diagnostic read back ?

once again i find myself talking well out my depth but , just for the non-gurus amongst us..

Davezj
05-05-2009, 08:00 PM
are these openport 2.0 cable really only available at a cost of about $160-$200 depending if you get all the connectors with it.

does anyone have an openport 2.0 cable that live north west england that wants a prefacelift Auto engine ecu to have a play with. let me know.

Davezj
05-05-2009, 08:08 PM
just to let you know the part number is MD340289 (metal box) with a MH7201FS processor. i know the theory is that the 7201 processor can not be flashed. but it worth a play. at least the map can be read and used as comparison.

evonut270
05-05-2009, 08:54 PM
Hey guys,

Small world, the BarryC who started the thread on geekmapped (http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/sho...p?t=276&page=5) is talking about MY VR4 (http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showpost.php?p=413187&postcount=53), that is where he got the def file in the first place.:thumbsup:

BarryC the GENIUS responsible for all this, anybody wishing to contact or thank him can do so via The Irish Mitsubishi Owners Club (http://www.irishmoc.org/). In the section for CW Performance.

Correct me if i'm wrong.he isnt the only one that made this possible.:scholar:

evonut270
05-05-2009, 08:55 PM
OK, done!! I have successfully flashed the VR4 ECU:2thumbsup. YES, my 98 VR4 MT ECU can be flashed without problem, and I can drive it without any problem.

Here is the config:

Software: ECUFlash 1.41.2483
OS: Windows XP
Cable: OpenPort 2.0 cable
ROM ID: 20030011


Simple test has been done, ie, set the RPM Limit to 3000rpm, and flashed the ROM, and test drove the car and then really cut at around 3000rpm :rolleyes3:rolleyes3


VR4 ---- Happy Tuning /rallyglad you managed to get it flashed if you need anymore help you know where i am./rally

Turbo_Steve
05-05-2009, 09:09 PM
If you intend to play with it a lot, different mods, different fuels and setups etc....then the MAP2 is probably better as you can map it in real time. The ECUFlash works best if you can make as few flashes as possible...this means having a base map as close to target as possible, and a few minimal changes. Keep changing it, and eventually you'll run out of flashes.


MAP2 can be tweaked all day and everyday without running out of reflashes: it's up in the tens-of-millions range.

evonut270
05-05-2009, 09:27 PM
If you intend to play with it a lot, different mods, different fuels and setups etc....then the MAP2 is probably better as you can map it in real time. The ECUFlash works best if you can make as few flashes as possible...this means having a base map as close to target as possible, and a few minimal changes. Keep changing it, and eventually you'll run out of flashes.


MAP2 can be tweaked all day and everyday without running out of reflashes: it's up in the tens-of-millions range. piggybacks are good alternatives to standalone but expensive compared to whats on offer now with ecuflash which imo is a better option.

Davezj
05-05-2009, 09:39 PM
is it just me or is the question Steve_turbo asked before about the ECU rest possibly wiping the changes made to the ECU, has not been answered.

anyone willing to answer? or just let me know what the answer was if it has been answered.

evonut270
05-05-2009, 09:46 PM
is it just me or is the question Steve_turbo asked before about the ECU rest possibly wiping the changes made to the ECU, has not been answered.

anyone willing to answer? or just let me know what the answer was if it has been answered.i answered that.if you disconnect the battery the ecu does NOT reset to factory settings.once flashed it stays until reflashed again.

Davezj
05-05-2009, 09:52 PM
i answered that.if you disconnect the battery the ecu does NOT reset to factory settings.once flashed it stays until reflashed again.

Excellent, Thanks for the update

Turbo_Steve
05-05-2009, 11:20 PM
Dave.....my fault there due to the way I asked the question. I had doubts the actual maps had been flashed (and not just volatile parameters) but yes, reading the thread on GeekMapped, the actual maps themselves (which are non-volatile on the VR4) have been changed. Whilst you can change individual points / parameters in volatile, to make a detailed map change requires a successful reflash.

Well done to everyone who has achieved this: Apologies for my cynicism regarding this, but there have been many "red herrings" with people using RPM limit or other volatile parameters proclaiming success, only to find a full ECU reset clears them. It's a heck of a big win, and if you can get the earlier CPUs to rewrite their non-volatile space, I think we'll all love you forever :D

kc427
06-05-2009, 07:56 AM
Dave.....my fault there due to the way I asked the question. I had doubts the actual maps had been flashed (and not just volatile parameters) but yes, reading the thread on GeekMapped, the actual maps themselves (which are non-volatile on the VR4) have been changed. Whilst you can change individual points / parameters in volatile, to make a detailed map change requires a successful reflash.

Well done to everyone who has achieved this: Apologies for my cynicism regarding this, but there have been many "red herrings" with people using RPM limit or other volatile parameters proclaiming success, only to find a full ECU reset clears them. It's a heck of a big win, and if you can get the earlier CPUs to rewrite their non-volatile space, I think we'll all love you forever :D

Steve, may I add a point about that, so that everyone can understand more about the logic. :happy:

Actually, those settings in the maps are stored in the flash(or you can call it non-volatile memory). Let's take an example, the RPM limit. The ECU program will keep checking the existing RPM, ie, the RPM you see from your tachometer, and let’s call it Current_RPM. Since the Current_RPM is a dynamic data or a input parameter, ie, it changes from time to time, so it will be stored in the RAM. Now, whenever the ECU program is checking the Current_RPM, it will do the following:

If (Current_RPM < RPM_Limit), then do nothing and continue the program, else if (Current_RPM > RPM_Limit), then cut fuel, cut ignition,etc…..


Of course, the real case is more complicated, but, the idea is similar to this.


So you can see, the RPM_Limit is just a constant value, and no need to be changed when the engine is running, that’s why, the RPM_Limit is stored into the flash, and it will be used when the program needs. Similarly, other settings do the the same, stored into the flash.

kc427
06-05-2009, 08:00 AM
glad you managed to get it flashed if you need anymore help you know where i am./rally

yeah, sure...... well, I will try the 2byte load sometimes this week, if I success, I will tell you all. :happy:

kc427
06-05-2009, 08:04 AM
Guys, just checked the H539F(same as 7202?) spec, and it mentioned the On-Chip flash supports only upto 100 times. So, it is true, there are only 100 times to do the flash!!! :sad3:Correct me if I am wrong.

Turbo_Steve
06-05-2009, 05:16 PM
Steve, may I add a point about that, so that everyone can understand more about the logic.

Actually, those settings in the maps are stored in the flash(or you can call it non-volatile memory). Let's take an example, the RPM limit. The ECU program will keep checking the existing RPM, ie, the RPM you see from your tachometer, and let’s call it Current_RPM. Since the Current_RPM is a dynamic data or a input parameter, ie, it changes from time to time, so it will be stored in the RAM. Now, whenever the ECU program is checking the Current_RPM, it will do the following:

If (Current_RPM < RPM_Limit), then do nothing and continue the program, else if (Current_RPM > RPM_Limit), then cut fuel, cut ignition,etc…..


Of course, the real case is more complicated, but, the idea is similar to this.


So you can see, the RPM_Limit is just a constant value, and no need to be changed when the engine is running, that’s why, the RPM_Limit is stored into the flash, and it will be used when the program needs. Similarly, other settings do the the same, stored into the flash.

KC...thanks for taking the time to clarify, and yes, I know what you are saying, but it's not the whole story. As I said, you can temporarily change the boost target and the RPM limit using the mitsubishi diagnostic tool. These remain in place until you cancel them with the MUT (mitsubishi tool) or until the ECU is reset. So they're not only in flash memory: Hence my question regarding the success of the process.

To summarise your process overview, it must be:
If (Current_RPM < (RPM_Limit - Volatile_RPM_limit)), then do nothing and continue the program, else if (Current_RPM > (RPM_Limit - Volatile_RPM_limit)), then invoke limiter etc

I understand the flashing process quite deeply: It's just that the particular variable you chose to prove it with (on this thread...not on Geekmapped) is one that IS available from Volatile memory, though presumably, as you say, it's a modifier to the Read Only tables.

I'm not doubting what you say, as you've clearly made changes to the map...it was purely the choice of RPM limit (which can be modified without flashing) as proof which I doubted.

I'm sorry if I wasn't very clear about my doubts: I really should take more time over posts sometimes.

kc427
06-05-2009, 07:06 PM
KC...thanks for taking the time to clarify, and yes, I know what you are saying, but it's not the whole story. As I said, you can temporarily change the boost target and the RPM limit using the mitsubishi diagnostic tool. These remain in place until you cancel them with the MUT (mitsubishi tool) or until the ECU is reset. So they're not only in flash memory: Hence my question regarding the success of the process.

To summarise your process overview, it must be:
If (Current_RPM < (RPM_Limit - Volatile_RPM_limit)), then do nothing and continue the program, else if (Current_RPM > (RPM_Limit - Volatile_RPM_limit)), then invoke limiter etc

I understand the flashing process quite deeply: It's just that the particular variable you chose to prove it with (on this thread...not on Geekmapped) is one that IS available from Volatile memory, though presumably, as you say, it's a modifier to the Read Only tables.

I'm not doubting what you say, as you've clearly made changes to the map...it was purely the choice of RPM limit (which can be modified without flashing) as proof which I doubted.

I'm sorry if I wasn't very clear about my doubts: I really should take more time over posts sometimes.

Something I still don't understand. You said I can temporarily change the boost target and the RPM limit using the Mitsubishi diagnostic tool, what tool is it? How does it work? Do you have any information about it or any link I can check? Sorry, but just curious and want to know more about that :happy:

Maybe this weekend, if I have time to do it, I will try to unplug the ECU, and then reconnect it after awhile to see the data is still there or not.... that's interesting. :thinking:

Just one more thing, it's 2am in the morning, so I will do it tomorrow, let me post a log graph from EvoScan, and show you the ignition timing different after I flashed the ROM. In the stock ROM, the highest number in the igniton map is 38, and the tuned ROM is 43. From both logs from EvoScan, I can see the ignition timing are correctly logged. I think the diagnostic tool cannot set the ignition timing, can it:thinking: Anyway, I post the picture tomorrow night. :happy:

kc427
06-05-2009, 07:18 PM
Tonight, I have tested the 2byte RPM, and it works, and the graph is almost exactly same as normal RPM graph. Unfortunately, I failed the more important one, 2byte Load, and I saw wrong data from the EvoScan. Anyway, I will investigate again to find out the 2byte Load.

2 byte RPM address is:

20030011

2byte RPM
MUT 02 = F0A8
MUT 03 = F0A9

Eurospec
06-05-2009, 08:49 PM
Guys, just checked the H539F(same as 7202?) spec, and it mentioned the On-Chip flash supports only upto 100 times. So, it is true, there are only 100 times to do the flash!!! :sad3:Correct me if I am wrong.

Yeah- they always say that- and to be fair its something you need to be prepared for, but......

Scoobys are supposed to have 5 erase and remap cycles according to my ecutek book, but you can do them literally thousands of times!

Flash is a PITA to map, but ecu flash on evos now has live mapping- which is much better.

Remapping the stock ecu is a very very good option.

Well done KC!

Cheers,

Ben.

Turbo_Steve
06-05-2009, 09:04 PM
LOL Flashing gets a lot better once there are a few published base maps out there..and if you're a tuner you tend to build up a few "choice" maps in your library for specific types of modification.

For example 550s + TD04s would seem a popular base map ;)
Rescaled MAF tables are also dead handy: usually one for a specific bypass and another for a larger MAF.

foxdie
06-05-2009, 09:33 PM
Please can someone clarify what exactly is needed for the other chips? (MH7201F and MH7203F)

I don't mind putting in a little time contacting chip suppliers in China to try and get some more info on these ICs.

Ps. out of curiosity, what chip is most likely to be in my PFL Auto 97 Galoon VR-4?

PaddyB
06-05-2009, 10:10 PM
Are there some data sheets around for these devices - I've looked but can't find any for love nor money.

I have plenty of experience with embedded flash devices (tho' not ECUs) & I've never seen any spec'd that weren't in the 1000s but I've seen plenty fail in the tens or hundreds - what technology is used in these ECUs ??

Davezj
06-05-2009, 10:28 PM
Paddy they are flashing the MH7202 which is apparently the H8/539 processor.

I think you already have the data sheet for this one.

file to big to upload. H8/539.pdf

so other docs for you though.

27235

27236

27237


I can email the H8/539.pdf to anyone that wants it, PM me you email address and i will foward it on.

or you could download it from here for free
http://www.datasheetarchive.com/search.php?q=H8%2F539F

Davezj
06-05-2009, 10:37 PM
the mh7201 processor is said to be a different core, MR16core but can anyone tell me what the full processor number is then i can get the data sheet to have a look for myself and maybe try to use the direct access port CN102 which is not populated on the ECU pcb but looks like it is a serial interface to the processor.

the H8/539F processor datasheet was easy to find when you have the full hitachi number but not locatable when you only have the mh7202. i can't find the datasheet for the mh7201 processor.

Kenneth
06-05-2009, 11:05 PM
Hopefully the following gives some more understanding of the difference between a re-flash of the ECU and changing values in memory (i.e. temporary RPM limit with the MUTT tool)

MCUs usually let you access their memory space and change stuff for debugging etc. So long as you follow the correct protocol, it isn't a problem and the ECU doesn't care.

A certain amount of data gets loaded from non-volatile (FLASH) storage into volatile storage (RAM) because it gets accessed very often, and the processor cycles that can be saved by not having to fetch it every time all add up. It is likely the RPM limit is one of these as you can bet your ass it gets checked very often.

During normal operation the ECU only checks the value in RAM. because the MCU will let you connect and change values in its memory, you can change the RPM limit variable in memory, and this affects the immediate running of the vehicle.

When the ECU restarts however, that value is gone as it re-loads the value in non-volatile storage.


When you re-flash the MCU, it re-writes the non-volatile memory which is the normal value which will be loaded when the ECU re-sets. Hence it being a permanent change.

PaddyB
06-05-2009, 11:35 PM
My experience of CPUs in harsh environments is that values in volatile memory are quite often rewritten periodically from the values stored in flash as they [in RAM] can get corrupted (this can even extend to the registers themselves in really noisy environments) so the values in RAM may not stick for long. Dunno how Mitsi have done it but I wouldn't be surprised either way.

IIRC the MR16Core is a processor/firmware combination, dunno what the CPU is so it could still be H8 (I think it is RISC based tho') - again very sketchy details on this on the web. If you fancy a get together sometime Dave then we can have a play with your ECU (as long as you don't mind it getting bricked :) ) & scope whats on those lines but without a datasheet it's hit & miss. I'll bet you a pint* tho that if you sniff those lines at 9k6 baud you'll get summat.

CHeers for the links Dave - I think I posted the programming guide on here somewhere but I've not seen the last one before.

VR4 MAD
06-05-2009, 11:36 PM
LOL Flashing gets a lot better once there are a few published base maps out there..and if you're a tuner you tend to build up a few "choice" maps in your library for specific types of modification.

For example 550s + TD04s would seem a popular base map ;)
Rescaled MAF tables are also dead handy: usually one for a specific bypass and another for a larger MAF.

Well I've been following this and other ECU flashing threads for sometime now with a great deal of interest. Great to see progress finally, as I've always thought modding the factory ECU was better than either a 'piggy-back' or a full third party replacement ECU.

Regarding "choice" maps, I maybe able to help here, as I have a couple of third party modified ECU's that I maybe able to download the data from to use as starting points for further 'tweaking'........... /rally

They are a 'Mines' modified ECU in a metal case from what would appear to be a PF VR4 and a 'Blitz Access' modified ECU in a black plastic case from a FL VR4. The blitz maps are for a quite heavily modified vehicle I believe.

Neither have made it into my car yet so I can't confirm what they are like or do for the performance............/pan /Grrr

/toycar

kc427
07-05-2009, 03:31 AM
Well I've been following this and other ECU flashing threads for sometime now with a great deal of interest. Great to see progress finally, as I've always thought modding the factory ECU was better than either a 'piggy-back' or a full third party replacement ECU.

Regarding "choice" maps, I maybe able to help here, as I have a couple of third party modified ECU's that I maybe able to download the data from to use as starting points for further 'tweaking'........... /rally

They are a 'Mines' modified ECU in a metal case from what would appear to be a PF VR4 and a 'Blitz Access' modified ECU in a black plastic case from a FL VR4. The blitz maps are for a quite heavily modified vehicle I believe.

Neither have made it into my car yet so I can't confirm what they are like or do for the performance............/pan /Grrr

/toycar


cool, you can read both the Mines and Blitz ROM, and let's use them as a base maps:iloveyou:

Kenneth
07-05-2009, 04:06 AM
If you would like, I am happy to try get the ECU images for you.


Well I've been following this and other ECU flashing threads for sometime now with a great deal of interest. Great to see progress finally, as I've always thought modding the factory ECU was better than either a 'piggy-back' or a full third party replacement ECU.

Regarding "choice" maps, I maybe able to help here, as I have a couple of third party modified ECU's that I maybe able to download the data from to use as starting points for further 'tweaking'........... /rally

They are a 'Mines' modified ECU in a metal case from what would appear to be a PF VR4 and a 'Blitz Access' modified ECU in a black plastic case from a FL VR4. The blitz maps are for a quite heavily modified vehicle I believe.

Neither have made it into my car yet so I can't confirm what they are like or do for the performance............/pan /Grrr

/toycar

MarkSanne
07-05-2009, 08:13 AM
I just have basic understanding of flashing ECU's and never done it myself. Only thing I flashed are PC motherboards and DVD-drives ;)

Am I right when I say it would be safe to change the ECU parameters (without reflashing!), try them out (do not turn of car!), retune, try again, retune, etc etc and when it's all good, then reflash the ECU with the desired (tested) parameters so you have 99 reflashes left?

Turbo_Steve
07-05-2009, 09:16 AM
That's not usually possible on the standard ECU software.
The Evo boys have cracked this on the later models, as they've reverse engineered the ECU code to allow it to read the maps out of volatile memory: so live tuning is possible, and then commit to non-volatile flash.

However, our ECU software currently reads direct from the flash memory. So the only place you can change a parameter to have the ECU read it is in the flash memory.

The good news is that the "reflash limit" is a bit nominal...i.e. what you really do is shorten the 'half-life' of the ECU memory....the more you flash it, the less charge it holds each time, so the shorter the overall chronological life of the memory. Bearing in mind these memories originally have a decay life measured in tens of years, the easiest way to look at it (though fundamentally incorrect) is to work on the assumption that the memory is designed to last 25 years and that each reflash shortens it's life by 5%. So the more you reflash it, the more likely the memory is to fail, and the less time it will retain the data.

Subaru memory was orginally rated at something like 100 flashes, and I've seen ECUs reflashed many many many times more than that with no ill effects. The catch is that they probably won't last as long in the car. The main cause of failures, however, is poor voltage control: noise on the powersupply, immobiliers, that kind of thing.

Turbo_Steve
07-05-2009, 09:59 AM
Question to the wonderful people who have actually achieved this brilliant result on the 7203.....is anyone actually looking into the earlier processors (7202 and 7201) or are you guys now concentrating on getting results out of the ECUs you can manipulate.

Davezj
07-05-2009, 01:08 PM
steve i was under the impression that it was the 7202 that is now flashable and the 7201 and 7203 that can not yet be done.

so it would be effectively facelifts 1998ish- XXXX not sure when the 7203 cut in but i seem to remeber someone saying about 2001ish.

please correct me if i wrong. If so i will get an administrator to delete this post.

Turbo_Steve
07-05-2009, 01:13 PM
Nope, you're correct I'm talking rubbish :D

It's the 7201 I'm mainly concerned with (as I have an Auto PFL) but I believe work is being done on the 7203 as it's used in the Eclipse, which is popular stateside.

Anyone know what the Evo 8,9 and 10 use?

Nutter_John
07-05-2009, 01:17 PM
if you had asked last week i would have opend my ecu as i had it out

Davezj
07-05-2009, 01:28 PM
yes i am after some 7201 info as well.

Paddy,
It would be good to check some things out but as you say without a manual/datasheet you are shooting in the dark. I have a basic bench scope and handheld scope but we would have to build a wiring harness up to power it on the bench, oh i do have power supplies as well, as i don't fancy probing the ECU in the car.
i don't see why misubishi would go to the trouble of rebranding a processor just to use it in a metal box, under the dash, "nobody in there right mind" is going to look in.
I do count myself and most other people on here as not being in there right mind, which i think is a fair comment.

kc427
07-05-2009, 01:45 PM
Here is the ignition log with Stock ROM. From the map, the highest number is 38, and from the graph, it shows correctly at 38 degree. That's when I released the throttle and changing gear, ie, with low engine load

kc427
07-05-2009, 01:47 PM
Now, I just increased the ignition below 100% engine load, and doing the test again. From the map, the highest number is 43, and from the graph, it shows correctly at 43 degree. That's when I released the throttle and changing gear, ie, with low engine load

Note: the timing is just for testing only :happy:

kc427
07-05-2009, 01:48 PM
Nope, you're correct I'm talking rubbish :D

It's the 7201 I'm mainly concerned with (as I have an Auto PFL) but I believe work is being done on the 7203 as it's used in the Eclipse, which is popular stateside.

Anyone know what the Evo 8,9 and 10 use?

They are using the Hitachi SH4B series CPU:thinking:

Confused
07-05-2009, 01:49 PM
Oooh, pretty colours!



I don't really know much of what's going on, but I assume it's fairly good if we're starting to understand our ECUs some more! (Though maybe not for my PFL Auto one :()

scientist
07-05-2009, 02:47 PM
You mean concentrating on 7201 and 7203 since they are flashing 7202s

Mr.Salas
07-05-2009, 05:04 PM
Hey guys New in this stuff, what do I need to buy to reflash my ECU my car is from the year 1998 so prefacelift and its manual. Can I reflash the ECU? or there is a spesifice model of ecu?

Davezj
07-05-2009, 05:35 PM
Hey guys New in this stuff, what do I need to buy to reflash my ECU my car is from the year 1998 so prefacelift and its manual. Can I reflash the ECU? or there is a spesifice model of ecu?

I think you mean you have a facelift 1998 or you could have one of the change over cars that had a bit of both in them.

If you can get to your ECU and look at the out side of the enclosure then it is a start if it is a metal box then i have only every seen 7201 processors in these and the answer is no at the moment.
But if it is a black plastic box then it is more than likely a 7202 processor in it an yes they can be flashed.

the best thing to do it remove the ECU and take a look inside.

pics of the different cases in this thread.

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24469

kc427
07-05-2009, 05:47 PM
I think you mean you have a facelift 1998 or you could have one of the change over cars that had a bit of both in them.

If you can get to your ECU and look at the out side of the enclosure then it is a start if it is a metal box then i have only every seen 7201 processors in these and the answer is no at the moment.
But if it is a black plastic box then it is more than likely a 7202 processor in it an yes they can be flashed.

the best thing to do it remove the ECU and take a look inside.

pics of the different cases in this thread.

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24469


It seems that,
- metal case using 7201
- plastic case with MDxxxxxx using 7202
- plastic case with MRxxxxxx using 7203

has anyone seen any exception? :thinking:

evonut270
07-05-2009, 08:15 PM
hopefully soon the 7203 processor will be able to be flashed.there are tests being carried out and should hopefully be out when v1.42 of ecuflash is released.

Mr.Salas
07-05-2009, 08:54 PM
Oh okies thanks , well I will take a look when I get the chance to do it. hmmm well yes its a 1998 model Prefacelift because it doesn't have the 2 fogs lamps at each end.

Davezj
07-05-2009, 10:02 PM
Oh okies thanks , well I will take a look when I get the chance to do it. hmmm well yes its a 1998 model Prefacelift because it doesn't have the 2 fogs lamps at each end.

you might be lucky and have a facelift ECU which would be good for you.

AderC
09-05-2009, 02:08 PM
Mine's a 1998 pre-facelift. Just been out to check the ECU and it's the plastic-case jobby :) I've been able to read the ROM from my car with the Openport 1.3 cable, which also indicates it's the 7202 rather than 7201 chip.

Openport 2.0 cable ordered!

aDe

Davezj
09-05-2009, 06:54 PM
You lucky, lucky bugger!

Wish i had one of Those, i have 2 of the others.

where did you order the cable from was it from tactrix $169 for basic or $198 with extra connectors. or did you find somewhere else.

AderC
09-05-2009, 09:07 PM
Entering my chassis number into ASA gives me a manufacture period 1998042, which I assume means week 42 of 1998, in which case mine must be very near the end of the prefacelifts, hence the facelift ECU :-)

I ordered from Tactrix, with the extra connectors.

I've also found the attached ROM file on my PC which I got hold of a while ago and is a tuned ROM from the guys in Russia. It has modified fuel and ignition maps, raised RPM limit, 0.9 bar boost via the stock solenoid, and raised limits for boost cut...

aDe

PS I obviously take no responsibility for any big smokey bangs caused by use of this ROM!

PaddyB
09-05-2009, 09:59 PM
I'm confused about the part numbers - I have MD340289 which I understood to be the 7201 part but theres a bloke on OZVR4 who says he's got a 7202 in his, & that file Ade posted is prefixed MD340289 which sort of hints that I might be able to reflash. I guess Dave & I will be visiting Widnes soon /Hmmm

Back to the 7201: I'm randomly stabbing about various datasheets to see if I can find a match - I had a hunch that it might be an H8/300 but there's millions of versions of them so I can't say for sure. I'm now beginning to suspect that it might be an FPGA - given the MR16Core thingy. Any thoughts anyone ??

bradc
09-05-2009, 10:16 PM
AderC - it means the 2nd week in April 1998

Davezj
09-05-2009, 11:27 PM
i don't supose anyone has a ECU breakout wiring harnes i can beg/steel/borrow/buy as i think we are going to start something here.

Personally i don't have much experience with reprogramming microprocessors and the like. but i do know electronics, and i did do TCL proramming for 18 months (with one of my job) so it can't be that difficult to crack this one. however a correct chip number would be really usefull if anyone knows it for the MH7201.

pbaron
10-05-2009, 12:21 AM
AderC - it means the 2nd week in April 1998
It means the 2nd 10 day period in April 1998.

Ryan
10-05-2009, 01:07 AM
Looky what I have here :)

uploaded/50107/1241914065.jpg

Stevo
10-05-2009, 01:42 AM
is the mh7201FC flash able??? its out of a 1997 P/FL ST-R

Gly
10-05-2009, 02:14 AM
no only the 7202 at this point in time

Stevo
10-05-2009, 02:18 AM
bummer o well maby tha other1s got the right cpu, i must check that wen i go n strip the rest of the parts out of it

Fully
10-05-2009, 02:29 AM
If your car had a 7201 or a 7203 ECU would there be any effects from swapping in a 7202 ECU as long as you match with manual/auto ECU to suit?

Stevo
10-05-2009, 02:35 AM
i have no idea, but im going to find out if it does have one of those ecu's, where is the transmission ecu btw?

bradc
10-05-2009, 04:07 AM
Yes you can swap ecu's across. Ryan has my old ecu from my facelift.

Ryan
10-05-2009, 04:14 AM
If your car had a 7201 or a 7203 ECU would there be any effects from swapping in a 7202 ECU as long as you match with manual/auto ECU to suit?

I've been using the 7202 for about year now, first time I've used my 7201 in a while. I am still observing.

scott.mohekey
10-05-2009, 07:12 AM
I have a manual ecu with the 7201 mcu in it sitting in the garage, so I took it apart to have a look. Next to the mcu is a few other chips, one of which is an ST micro programmable flash. The datasheet for this is available here: http://www.digchip.com/datasheets/download_datasheet.php?id=549311&part-number=M28F102.

I imagine on this ecu, this chip is where the tables etc are stored. It's probably possible to program this chip outside of the ecu if no other way of programming the ecu is found. The datasheet says it has 10,000 write cycles.

Also, next to the mcu is a set of five through holes for a connector labelled CN102 which is probably some form of ISP connector.

AderC
10-05-2009, 11:52 AM
It means the 2nd 10 day period in April 1998.

I should have worked out it wasn't week 42 seeing as the car was delivered to first owner in May 98 /pan

Davezj
10-05-2009, 12:54 PM
hopefully someone will be able to confirm this but if you read the data direct from memory, you will get it as a HEX dump (what is effectively a text file) and this is not very helpfull in diagnosing the maps.
we may well be able get the hex dump and feed it in to ecu flash to construct it into so kind of readable data.

kc427
10-05-2009, 04:36 PM
I have a manual ecu with the 7201 mcu in it sitting in the garage, so I took it apart to have a look. Next to the mcu is a few other chips, one of which is an ST micro programmable flash. The datasheet for this is available here: http://www.digchip.com/datasheets/download_datasheet.php?id=549311&part-number=M28F102.

I imagine on this ecu, this chip is where the tables etc are stored. It's probably possible to program this chip outside of the ecu if no other way of programming the ecu is found. The datasheet says it has 10,000 write cycles.

Also, next to the mcu is a through holes for a connector labelled CN102 which is probably some form of ISP connector.

If it is the case, maybe you need to de-solder the STMicro flash, then read it from a programmer. Or after you de-solder it, solder a socket on the board, so you can flash and reflash easier like plug-n-play.

Davezj
10-05-2009, 08:58 PM
i am sure you can get little clips that will fit over the chip legs and you can moitor all the pins on the chip while it is active.

but to read it propperly you could desolder it put it in a programmer to read. It would not be that tricky.

scott.mohekey
10-05-2009, 10:06 PM
Yeah, desoldering wouldn't be too difficult. Soldering it or a socket back on would be a bit more tricky. I also have a same generation auto ecu which I could mess with, rather than breaking the manual one. I have a spare AVR microcontroller that I could use to interface the flash chip with a pc com port too. I might give this a whirl over the next few days.

Fully
13-05-2009, 07:58 AM
Yeah, desoldering wouldn't be too difficult. Soldering it or a socket back on would be a bit more tricky.

That is what soldering braid is used for with a magnifying glass. Using a temputure adjusting soldering iron, as cheap ones get to hot for the tracks and the board.

scott.mohekey
13-05-2009, 08:05 AM
Yeah, I have all the gear, just not overly confident with such fiddly soldering.

AderC
18-05-2009, 07:32 PM
Just got round to testing my shiny new Openport 2.0 cable - reflashing works fine on my car :2thumbsup

I modified the RPM limit and a couple of the low load AFR values slightly, reflashed and re-read the ECU and the modified values were still there (and the car still starts!)

The ECUFlash definition file isn't quite right yet. The Boost Cut Load Limit and Boost Desired Engine Load - A tables both start at the same address, so I'm not going to start any real hacking until this is sorted, but it's good to know the reflashing works.

aDe

[19:23:54.575] -- comparing ECU flash memory pages to image file --
[19:23:54.575] seg start len ecu CRC32 img CRC32 same?
[19:23:54.725] FB16 00010000 00003000 D7C14B88 D7C14B88 YES
[19:23:54.745] FB01 00013000 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:54.785] FB02 00013200 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:54.805] FB03 00013400 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:54.835] FB04 00013600 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:54.866] FB05 00013800 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:54.876] FB06 00013A00 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:54.926] FB07 00013C00 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:54.966] FB08 00013E00 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[19:23:55.176] FB15 00014000 00004000 F9428341 F9428341 YES
[19:23:55.376] FB14 00018000 00004000 9C038689 9C038689 YES
[19:23:55.577] FB13 0001C000 00004000 690B37D3 690B37D3 YES
[19:23:55.777] FB12 00020000 00004000 3792E004 3792E004 YES
[19:23:55.987] FB11 00024000 00004000 91DCA252 91DCA252 YES
[19:23:56.187] FB10 00028000 00004000 B9B933F1 B9B933F1 YES
[19:23:56.398] FB09 0002C000 00004000 A002D0EC A002D0EC YES
[19:23:56.398] flash correct! exiting.

PaddyB
18-05-2009, 08:13 PM
I sense a Widnes mini-meet in the offing ;)

AderC
18-05-2009, 08:45 PM
I sense a Widnes mini-meet in the offing ;)

Busy next 2 weekends, but then the weekend after that it's the NW rolling road day and I'll be armed with laptop and cable. Hopefully the definition file will be sorted by then so we can start playing with the boost settings of the standard solenoid.

Davezj
18-05-2009, 11:10 PM
good news Ade, i will see you there.

i might have a little more info on the MH7201 chip identity. Thought i would plough through some family tree docs for the H8/300 processor and found a few bits and pieces out.

(Switching to Homes Mode, Sherlock Homes Mode.)

our version of the MH7201 has 100 pins.

if it is, as suspected and the MH7201 processor is an H8/300 type then i think i have found which family it belong to and it is the H8/3437.

look at the family tree docs i have found. Remember our processor is 100 pin.

follow the trail and it will specify the emulator board required for flashing and the programming software, etc, etc.

Can someone have a hunt through and double check my findings.

27543

27545

27546

27550

27551

27552



The pinout doc is not relivant and can be ignored it is from 2002, far to late in the processors life to be improtant. However the 1997 Tech doc has a picture of the H8/3048 on the cover and it is apparent that the H8/3048 is a 16 bit processor and not an 8 bit like the H8/3437 family.

you can download datasheet here for free!
http://www.datasheetarchive.com/search.php?q=+h8%2F300+pinout

H8/3437 Hardware manual is on ther but it is 1.9mb too big to upload.

Davezj
18-05-2009, 11:44 PM
27553

my mistake here it is uploaded.

Davezj
18-05-2009, 11:55 PM
This looked to be a good manual

27554

But if you have a look at the pin out Pins 43,44,45,46,47 (CN102 in ECU) do not seem to tie up with any particular port on the processor.

maybe it is a 16 bit version the H8/3048 and i am barking up the wrong tree with the 8bit processor.

time for another search.

Davezj
19-05-2009, 12:09 AM
Well here is the hardware manual but the pinout again does not seem to tie up.

this time it is too big.

so here is another one.

27555

Davezj
19-05-2009, 12:14 AM
If you have had a trawl through some of this stuff it might become aparent that the Clocking Freq is only 16Mhz on the H8/3048 and i can see from my ECU theat my MH7201 is clocked at 20Mhz as there is a crystal sat next the MH7201 with 20Mhz written on it. i suppose this could be divided down but why would they not just use a 16Mhz crystal..

this makes me think the processor is a newer version of the H3048 as clock speeds only go up not down.

search again.

scott.mohekey
19-05-2009, 12:16 AM
It could be overclocked. Generally the max speed specified on the datasheet is provisional.

Davezj
19-05-2009, 12:45 AM
Here is another one it is the short form catalogue fir the H8/300H Series Microcontrollers

27557

Davezj
19-05-2009, 01:36 AM
Last one for now.

here a step towards M16C thoughts

27558

Look at the M16C/60 clock division posibilities. 20mhz external clock 2:1 division and the M16C runs at 10Mhz. i know it is a long shot but i am going to bed.

i really thought i was getting somewhere earlier but it seem circles are the shape for today. maybe the M16C/60 is the way to start looking now.

orionn2o
19-05-2009, 09:10 AM
Quick question guys.. I was thinking if i could get one of these into my lab i'd like to have a play. So does the MUT-II connector wiring just wire directly into the ECU??

I'm presuming all i'd need is a PSU, ECU and a MUT-II and some soldering skills?

PaddyB
19-05-2009, 12:09 PM
Last one for now.

here a step towards M16C thoughts

27558

Look at the M16C/60 clock division posibilities. 20mhz external clock 2:1 division and the M16C runs at 10Mhz. i know it is a long shot but i am going to bed.

i really thought i was getting somewhere earlier but it seem circles are the shape for today. maybe the M16C/60 is the way to start looking now.

I've also done the 'let's google "100-pin LQFP M16C"' thing & found pretty much the same as you. Anyhoo in an inspired moment of genius I thought "balls to this - lets ask someone else" so I've pinged a couple of emails to the people at Renesas (who now possess Hitachi's & MistubishiChips IP) - hopefully they can answer & the relevant data sheet can be found.


Quick question guys.. I was thinking if i could get one of these into my lab i'd like to have a play. So does the MUT-II connector wiring just wire directly into the ECU??

I'm presuming all i'd need is a PSU, ECU and a MUT-II and some soldering skills?
& the datasheet - which is where we seem to be stalled at the mo.

I don't know for sure but I believe the MUT connector plugs into the socket under the steering wheel.

swinks
19-05-2009, 12:35 PM
If you have had a trawl through some of this stuff it might become aparent that the Clocking Freq is only 16Mhz on the H8/3048 and i can see from my ECU theat my MH7201 is clocked at 20Mhz as there is a crystal sat next the MH7201 with 20Mhz written on it. i suppose this could be divided down but why would they not just use a 16Mhz crystal..

this makes me think the processor is a newer version of the H3048 as clock speeds only go up not down.

search again.

Bear in mind that crystal might be working on a harmonic freq. You just have to check if there's any resonance circuit i.e. LC working with crystal. Then we can figure out if crystal is working on 20MHZ or other freq.
Has anyone electric circuit of "7201" ECU with crystal on it, I can send one to my dad who's radiotech engineer, y'know every little helps :tiny: .

VR-04-TT
19-05-2009, 12:52 PM
Keep up the good work guys, this is a very interesting thread! :)

kc427
19-05-2009, 01:01 PM
Good job guys, have some rep :P:P

Just a note, currently, I am finding the 2byte load from VR4 rom, but, still can't find. Even taking example from EVO ROM, I still can't find it successfully. If anyone can find any tutorial, please let me know, cheers... :)

PaddyB
19-05-2009, 03:21 PM
Well I got an answer of sorts from Renesas (which is promising) - the people I asked don't know as it's not a current part but it's been passed on to the Tactical Marketing Division & I should hear in 2-3 days what it is. Fingers crossed

Davezj
19-05-2009, 07:13 PM
I have been having a bit more of a hunt around and i too was drawn to the RENESAS web site.

i have been looking at the M16C/60, M16C80, M16C/6N (automotive). these are 20mhz micros of about the right era, and are/were made by mitsbishi electronic

I will do more searching. but the package looks like it is a PLQ0100Kx-x which the the square 100 pin quad flat pack.

I will see if i can get the pin outs for the possible micros and compaire them to see if they are pin compatable. then i will check to see if they are pin compatable with the H8/539 (MH7202) you guess why i am doing this. wish me luck.

Davezj
19-05-2009, 09:32 PM
Well i have been trawling again and i have downloaded all possible datasheets for a 100 pin, 20mhz,16bit micro for all the H8/300 and M16C family of processors.

now i have to sift through them.

the package type is an interesting one, i have look at one of the docs and it says a 100 pin quad plat pack square is 14mmx14mm the mh7201 is 22mmx22mm. so it does not match up with the M16C data sheet titled

M16C family. (30mb file)

here is the pic from page 58.

i don't really believe this
27592

but that is what is says the package size is.

White Lightning
20-05-2009, 08:57 AM
Whilst reading this thread last night I noticed that the attachments in posts #76 and #77 and the uploaded image in post #94 were broken due to the site migration. So, I have just been on to the old server (which is still active for the moment) and nabbed the files.

So, the posts mentioned above are now fixed :D

By the way, great thread this, very interesting :thumbsup:

PaddyB
20-05-2009, 03:22 PM
Well i have been trawling again and i have downloaded all possible datasheets for a 100 pin, 20mhz,16bit micro for all the H8/300 and M16C family of processors.

now i have to sift through them.

the package type is an interesting one, i have look at one of the docs and it says a 100 pin quad plat pack square is 14mmx14mm the mh7201 is 22mmx22mm. so it does not match up with the M16C data sheet titled

M16C family. (30mb file)

here is the pic from page 58.

i don't really believe this
27592

but that is what is says the package size is.

I agree - there appears to be no direct match for the package. I just have a feeling that it's an FPGA with an M16Core macrocell.

I've been focussing on pins 43-47 to see what the purpose of the connector (CN102? IIRC) could be. A lot of the M16C devices have functionality for clocking data in & out of those pins but it looks to be incomplete (I'd expect 41 & 42 to be on there as well & I've no idea as to the what pin47 could be for)

We could really do with the schematics for these boards - d'you reckon we can get them ??

kinkyafro
20-05-2009, 07:49 PM
I've been focussing on pins 43-47 to see what the purpose of the connector (CN102? IIRC) could be. A lot of the M16C devices have functionality for clocking data in & out of those pins but it looks to be incomplete (I'd expect 41 & 42 to be on there as well & I've no idea as to the what pin47 could be for)

Howabout a I2C serial connector (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%C2%B2C)

pure speculation but quite a few of the data sheets above mention serial interfaces - look at how this

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=23951&d=1223468842

compares with an example I2C connector (http://www.oopic.com/con5.htm) (pic attached below)

27602

PaddyB
20-05-2009, 08:34 PM
Howabout a I2C serial connector (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%C2%B2C)

pure speculation but quite a few of the data sheets above mention serial interfaces - look at how this

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=23951&d=1223468842

compares with an example I2C connector (http://www.oopic.com/con5.htm) (pic attached below)

27602

/Hmmm Could be. My understanding of IIC is 4 lines are required - Vpp, GND, SCL & SDA (dunno what the fifth could be for). I don't remember seeing any datasheets that had SCL & SDA - but then I don't remember much. I shall be keeping my eye on these.

For those who've successfully reflashed the 7202 - do you connect to the target board directly or go thru the OBD/MUT connector ??

Turbo_Steve
20-05-2009, 09:04 PM
It's using the ODB connector, Paddy.

kinkyafro
20-05-2009, 09:11 PM
Paddy it's

1 LSDL - Local I2C Serial Data
2 GND - Ground
3 LSCA - Local I2C Serial Clock
4 +5V - +5 Volt Power
5 RESET - Reset (Active Low)

in the example implementation I linked above...

peter thomson
20-05-2009, 11:27 PM
By the way, my ECU is MD340288 plastic case.

The manual VR4 we are breaking has the plastic case MD340288 ecu

Beastlee
20-05-2009, 11:33 PM
Where shall we start the bidding? I might be interested, I imagine it would work well with the piggy back e-manage.

peter thomson
20-05-2009, 11:38 PM
Where shall we start the bidding? I might be interested, I imagine it would work well with the piggy back e-manage.

I'll have to check it does have the right processor first though. lol

phosty
21-05-2009, 10:53 PM
Won't your brother need the manual ecu for the manual conversion Peter?

peter thomson
21-05-2009, 10:54 PM
Won't your brother need the manual ecu for the manual conversion Peter?

May do but not 100% convinced it would be needed.

Davezj
21-05-2009, 11:16 PM
Let me know how much pete, and you can put it in with the wing.

Davezj
21-05-2009, 11:33 PM
Anyway back on topic.

I asked Renesas if they had data sheets on the MH7201, MH7202 and MH7203.

They said that the number quoted were a customers custum processor and if i needed the datasheet i should contact them. Renesas did say they were used in the automotive industry.

so that means they do have the data sheets but are not allowed to distribute them.

so no joy for me there.

on the package front the size of the MH7201 is a very odd one.
22mm x 22mm and 100 pins. i have not found a package of this size in any of my footprint library's.

and all the data sheets i have downloaded the package sizes don't line up.

can someone with a mh7202 processor measure it and tell me how many pins it has got, as there is always the possibility that they are pin compatable and just swap in the newer chip.
It is not likly but worth a shot.
I could at least check the MH7201 chip for power and GND to see if they are the same.
What do you think the chances are!

PaddyB
21-05-2009, 11:37 PM
IIRC MH7202 are 112 pin LFPQ.

PaddyB
21-05-2009, 11:47 PM
Not even under NDA - who'd you speak to Dave??

Davezj
21-05-2009, 11:47 PM
shame.

i thought the MH7201 QFP-100 pin but it turns out the pin configuration is correct for the square package, but it is the size is just odd, the normal QFD-100pin is 14mmx 14mm.

Davezj
21-05-2009, 11:49 PM
Here is the actual reply

"Dear Mr Wallis,

In reply to your enquiry via our web site. The MH7201, Mh7202,MH7203 are
part numbers of custom devices manufactured we believe for a Japanese
automotive OEM. We are therefore not able to provide information on these
devices to you and in fact hold no data on them in Europe.

We suggest that you contact the manufacturer of the equipment containing
these devices and request the information you require via them.

Sorry we can not be of further help.

Regards Stuart Archer
FAE Manager"

now i have read it again i might put the same question to the Japnese division as it seems to suggest i might be able to get it from them. or am i just clutching at straws.

Davezj
21-05-2009, 11:52 PM
Paddy did you get the the pin count from the processor itself or did you get it from the H8/539 datasheet

PaddyB
21-05-2009, 11:57 PM
I asked their people in America - hopefully I'll get a different more positive response.

I'm coming to the belief that we actually need the schematics as the reflashing is done thru' the OBD port & (assuming it's not write once) do what needs to be done to unprotect the flash.

Anybody got an in with MitsubishiChips ??

PaddyB
21-05-2009, 11:57 PM
Paddy did you get the the pin count from the processor itself or did you get it from the H8/539 datasheet

datasheet

VR-04-TT
29-05-2009, 09:46 AM
No further developments lads?

Ryan
29-05-2009, 10:25 AM
No further developments lads?

Apart from this bit of info, no:

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39635&page=4

VR-04-TT
29-06-2009, 01:01 PM
Here's a pic of my 7202 chip if it's of any help:

Davezj
29-06-2009, 01:42 PM
Here's a pic of my 7202 chip if it's of any help:

do you have a dimension on that chip accross the body of the chip flat to flat.

if it is 22mm then it is another odd ball size to stop the like of us copy/replace it with another.

here is a thought. if you get qa smaller processor that uses the same signal lines as the original, does not have to be in the same place. we could get a convertion PCB made to fit the shape of the original processor with a replacement small device mounted on to it. i have done that in the past for obsolete devices. then the non matching pins can be retracked to where they need to go.

how does that sound.

kc427
29-06-2009, 04:32 PM
Good news, there is latest version of EcuFlash, v1.42, and it states, "support for flashing H8/539FA processor (e.g. Evo 6.5) via new H8539FA memory model "

Therefore, MH7203 can be flashed now. Try... /Nuuu

bradc
29-06-2009, 08:07 PM
Cool :)

Davezj
29-06-2009, 09:39 PM
but what about all the prefacelift auto drivers out there, there has to more of them than all the other types put together.

whine, whine, moan, moan, guess what i have, a PFL Auto.

Turbo_Steve
29-06-2009, 10:04 PM
Can I join in? ECU flash for those cars wil singlehandedly transform the tuning landscape of this club.

Kenneth
29-06-2009, 10:17 PM
Support is there for MH7203 processors now.

It doesn't work though, there is a CRC error in one of the sections and I can't get rid of it. Basically my 2002 ECU us stuffed at present (wont start) due to this problem. Even when I flash back the original image, there is some part of it which is basically random and buggers it up.

Good thing I have a couple of ECUs lying around :P

VR-04-TT
29-06-2009, 11:11 PM
do you have a dimension on that chip accross the body of the chip flat to flat.

if it is 22mm then it is another odd ball size to stop the like of us copy/replace it with another.

here is a thought. if you get qa smaller processor that uses the same signal lines as the original, does not have to be in the same place. we could get a convertion PCB made to fit the shape of the original processor with a replacement small device mounted on to it. i have done that in the past for obsolete devices. then the non matching pins can be retracked to where they need to go.

how does that sound.

Will measure it tonight and get back to you :)

Davezj
29-06-2009, 11:29 PM
Support is there for MH7203 processors now.

It doesn't work though, there is a CRC error in one of the sections and I can't get rid of it. Basically my 2002 ECU us stuffed at present (wont start) due to this problem. Even when I flash back the original image, there is some part of it which is basically random and buggers it up.

Good thing I have a couple of ECUs lying around :P


you are a brave man ken.

PaddyB
30-06-2009, 12:42 AM
Support is there for MH7203 processors now.

It doesn't work though, there is a CRC error in one of the sections and I can't get rid of it. Basically my 2002 ECU us stuffed at present (wont start) due to this problem. Even when I flash back the original image, there is some part of it which is basically random and buggers it up.

Good thing I have a couple of ECUs lying around :P

You can do a bitwise comparison of the image you're attempting to flash & the image in flash then you can tell the bytes that fail. I'd wager a guess that the tool you're using calculates the CRC using a different polynomial to the chip's algorithm - hence the mismatch. Or the CRC regions don't match. Unless it's been reflashed loads it can be recovered with the right tools (JTAG & hitachi toolchain)

Ryan
30-06-2009, 02:15 AM
Support is there for MH7203 processors now.

It doesn't work though, there is a CRC error in one of the sections and I can't get rid of it. Basically my 2002 ECU us stuffed at present (wont start) due to this problem. Even when I flash back the original image, there is some part of it which is basically random and buggers it up.

Good thing I have a couple of ECUs lying around :P

Just make sure mine doesn't end up with a CRC error :uhoh: :p

kc427
30-06-2009, 04:40 AM
but what about all the prefacelift auto drivers out there, there has to more of them than all the other types put together.

whine, whine, moan, moan, guess what i have, a PFL Auto.


Since those prefacelift ECU using different CPU core, so, the whole process to flash is different, I am not sure, but I guess, maybe the CPU cannot be flash throught the I/O port, or hardward disable, or something else. I think, it's worth to get a facelift ECU if want to do the tuning..... /rally

kc427
30-06-2009, 04:43 AM
Support is there for MH7203 processors now.

It doesn't work though, there is a CRC error in one of the sections and I can't get rid of it. Basically my 2002 ECU us stuffed at present (wont start) due to this problem. Even when I flash back the original image, there is some part of it which is basically random and buggers it up.

Good thing I have a couple of ECUs lying around :P

oh dear.... you cannot start the car, but, can you still connect to the ECU and read from ROM?

Kenneth
30-06-2009, 04:46 AM
Yep. Can still re-flash it too, so fingers crossed it can be fixed.

I actually don't flash the ECU while in the car, I have a bench harness made up so I can do that inside and connected to mains driven power (12v from the PC power supply) :P


oh dear.... you cannot start the car, but, can you still connect to the ECU and read from ROM?

kc427
30-06-2009, 10:43 AM
Yep. Can still re-flash it too, so fingers crossed it can be fixed.

I actually don't flash the ECU while in the car, I have a bench harness made up so I can do that inside and connected to mains driven power (12v from the PC power supply) :P

then, maybe we need to wait for the next release.....:p

phosty
30-06-2009, 12:27 PM
Here's a pic of my 7202 chip if it's of any help:

That image of the 7202 chip board is quite different to that on the PFL 7201 boards:

uploaded/4134/1246360636.jpg

Interestingly you can see what is presumably a connector space (CON102) just below the CPU - maybe for in-circuit programming (JTAG??) . It's a 5 pin connector wired to pins 43 thru 47 of the CPU chip. I've read elsewhere that people have managed to use a similar method to reprogram the early evo's using some sort of interface (but the web-page is all in japanese and not very clear when translated by google).

Does this help those of you in the know on such things?

See also here:
http://kaele.com/~kashima/car/evo/
http://www.club3g.com/forum/3g-eclipse-gt-gts-specific/108846-looking-circuit-board-photos-2000-v6-mt-ecu.html#post2486678
http://forums.openecu.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=671&start=165

scott.mohekey
30-06-2009, 09:24 PM
If you look closely at that picture in the bottom right, there is a chip labelled ST M28F102. This is a 64K x 16 CMOS flash eeprom. Programmable with a reasonably simple interface. I'm willing to bet that this is where the microcontroller stores it's "rom". We could in theory, desolder this, or piggy back it with a socket to enable us to read/write to it without the microcontrollers help.

I've attached the datasheet for it.

kinkyafro
30-06-2009, 10:21 PM
If you look closely at that picture in the bottom right, there is a chip labelled ST M28F102. This is a 64K x 16 CMOS flash eeprom. Programmable with a reasonably simple interface. I'm willing to bet that this is where the microcontroller stores it's "rom". We could in theory, desolder this, or piggy back it with a socket to enable us to read/write to it without the microcontrollers help.

I've attached the datasheet for it.

Good spot! at 128kilobytes it's the same size as the downloaded roms doing the rounds and I can't think what else an ecu would need that much storage for. I think your onto something.

10,000 program/erase cycles too!

scott.mohekey
30-06-2009, 10:42 PM
I was considering making a daughterboard with an inverted plcc socket, and a microcontroller with a usb/rs232 connection to enable us to flash it. Shouldn't be tooo hard. Power it from usb, pipe input from usb to the rom.

kinkyafro
30-06-2009, 11:43 PM
I was considering making a daughterboard with an inverted plcc socket, and a microcontroller with a usb/rs232 connection to enable us to flash it. Shouldn't be tooo hard. Power it from usb, pipe input from usb to the rom.

This eprom flashing contraption is alledgely compatible (using the supplied 40 pin to 44 pin adapter) LINKY (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/EPROM-FLASH-MPU-PIC-USB-Universal-Programmer-+27C256_W0QQitemZ190316471846QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxZ 20090623?IMSfp=TL090623153004r17289)

so presumably all you need to do is desolder the M28F102, stick it in the prom flasher, solder a handy socket on your ecu and your all set?

scott.mohekey
30-06-2009, 11:45 PM
That looks like it could be perfect!

All we need then is a daughterboard with a plcc socket so we don't have to keep desoldering the chip when we want to reflash.

VR-04-TT
01-07-2009, 11:12 AM
Would you have to make the daughter board or is it something you could buy?

I ask because I will have a 7201 ecu I can muck around with when I swap the 7202 in and I like to tinker with things like this. Plus I can get printed circuit board kits through work.

Confused
01-07-2009, 11:17 AM
If you look closely at that picture in the bottom right, there is a chip labelled ST M28F102. This is a 64K x 16 CMOS flash eeprom. Programmable with a reasonably simple interface. I'm willing to bet that this is where the microcontroller stores it's "rom". We could in theory, desolder this, or piggy back it with a socket to enable us to read/write to it without the microcontrollers help.

I've attached the datasheet for it.
That is a wonderful spot! If it pans out, almost definitely this single post will be a defining moment in VR4 history! ;) I've given you some Rep for the spot and upload - even if it doesn't pan out, it's still a great avenue to look down for us PFL owners! ;)

scott.mohekey
01-07-2009, 11:56 AM
Would you have to make the daughter board or is it something you could buy?

I ask because I will have a 7201 ecu I can muck around with when I swap the 7202 in and I like to tinker with things like this. Plus I can get printed circuit board kits through work.

The ebay page that kinky afro links to has a pre built eeprom programmer that should be suitable, however it requires desoldering the eeprom to get it into the programmer and then soldering it back in.

I have an idea for a method that wont involve soldering the ecu itself, but will require a custom made circuit board with an upside down plcc socket on the bottom of it. Back in my days with the Amiga computer, this technique was used to upgrade the CPU on some models.

For a more permanent solution, it should be possible to create a daughter board that could be soldered in place of the eeprom. I'm not sure if that specific eeprom supports multiple microcontrollers accessing it at the same time though, so it will probably either mean we have to build it so you switch the ignition (and therefore the ecu) off during a flash, or perhaps putting two of the eeproms onto the daughterboard, one being the live one, the other being the one to be programmed, then have some logic to enable switching the live one out from under the ecu. I'll think on this some more, but I should be able to figure out a prototype.

Does anyone know if the OBD connector has wires going directly to the ecu? It might be possible to 'borrow' them while the ecu is powered off. Otherwise we'll have to add some form of connector for live flashing.

Kitty's VR4
01-07-2009, 12:36 PM
Yep there are 2,

ECU ~ 12Pin C-37 Harness = Pin6 goes to Diagnostic OBD Pin1
ECU ~ 12Pin C-37 Harness = Pin12 goes to Diagnostic OBD Pin7

kinkyafro
01-07-2009, 08:31 PM
The ebay page that kinky afro links to has a pre built eeprom programmer that should be suitable, however it requires desoldering the eeprom to get it into the programmer and then soldering it back in.


Having shopped around a bit more I prefer the look of this Flasher (http://www.mcumall.com/comersus/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4282) with this adapter (http://www.mcumall.com/comersus/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4290) (more expensive but looks better quality with better looking support from the manufacturer).




Does anyone know if the OBD connector has wires going directly to the ecu? It might be possible to 'borrow' them while the ecu is powered off. Otherwise we'll have to add some form of connector for live flashing.

Wouldn't worry about that, the Installed ECU is easily accessible would just need a hole in the outer casing and you can run as many wires as you want.



just one concern for me at the moment - are the mh7202 rom images compatible with the mh7201 processors?

scott.mohekey
01-07-2009, 10:39 PM
The PLCC sockets are about $1.50 (NZ) from farnell, and you can get suitable microcontrollers for next to nothing.

Turbo_Steve
01-07-2009, 10:48 PM
Easiest thing to do is read out the image and see what looks the same. If the tables are at the same addresses........it's all good.

VR-04-TT
01-07-2009, 11:45 PM
The PLCC sockets are about $1.50 (NZ) from farnell, and you can get suitable microcontrollers for next to nothing.

We have an account with Farnell as well :D Sweet.

I don't really have the knowledge to do this on my own, but I'm very keen to learn, so please bear with my questions if they seem elementary. :D

scott.mohekey
01-07-2009, 11:49 PM
These are the sockets I'm looking at. I've gone with through hole as its easier to prototype with.

http://nz.farnell.com/multicomp/6601-44-pps-12-f6/socket-ic-plcc-44way/dp/1103873

zedy1
04-07-2009, 12:22 PM
Can someone confirm if ecu with the part number MD340290 is out of a vr4 as i have two ecu with the 7202 chip
i also have oone with part number md240289 with the 7202

peter thomson
04-07-2009, 12:52 PM
It dosen't appear to be listed as one of the VR4 ecu's. It's for a N/A Galant 2.5

kinkyafro
05-07-2009, 12:01 PM
Right I'm planning to attempt dumping the M28F102 flash chip. I'll report back with a rom image or WTB:ecu once my stuff arrives from China.

Louis
05-07-2009, 12:59 PM
cool, looking good!

VR4WGN
08-07-2009, 02:22 AM
keep us informed,well done guys,whatta read but i got there in the end lol,might hang onto 1 of my 7202's and the 7203 just incase,i htink iv just landed another 7202 so Orion your welcome to grab the 7202s anyhow

Stevo
11-07-2009, 09:58 AM
Where can i get a definition file for these rom images?

i dont have the cable or a compatiable ecu bit i would like to have a play around and eventually try and crack the mh7201 ecu after i have learnt how it is done

Legnum
14-07-2009, 12:22 PM
How about H8/539 (not H8/539F) flashing, is it possible ?
I have tried to read rom with ecuflash 1.42 / tactrix 2.0 without success.
I think the connection is ok, ecuflash starts to communicate, but ends when sending kernel size or something like that.
Box is a plastic case MD340288 (97 manual).

Davezj
14-07-2009, 01:19 PM
How about H8/539 (not H8/539F) flashing, is it possible ?
I have tried to read rom with ecuflash 1.42 / tactrix 2.0 without success.
I think the connection is ok, ecuflash start to communicate, but ends when sending kernel size or something like that.
Box is a plastic case MD340288 (97 manual).


Is that picture of your ECU, as it is the only one i have ever seen with the H8/539 printed on the chip they normally have MH7202 printed on them and it took a long time just to find out what chip was actually used in these ecu in the first place, and i mean a long time.

does the H8/539 have a conformal coating ( bubbley resin coating) on it like the other chips on the board. If NOT then it suggests to me that the chip may have been replaced at some point for a standard off the shelf replacement.

i believe the facelift VR4 use the same ECU, the MD340288 and it is only the prefacelift auto's that use the MD340289 metal case.

however i now have a MD340289 plastic case ECU with a MH7202 processor which i hope is flashable. i can only assume it is some kind of change over model, between prefacelift and facelift.

Legnum
14-07-2009, 01:55 PM
Is that picture of your ECU, as it is the only one i have ever seen with the H8/539 printed on the chip they normally have MH7202 printed on them and it took a long time just to find out what chip was actually used in these ecu in the first place, and i mean a long time.

does the H8/539 have a conformal coating ( bubbley resin coating) on it like the other chips on the board. If NOT then it suggests to me that the chip may have been replaced at some point for a standard off the shelf replacement.

i believe the facelift VR4 use the same ECU, the MD340288 and it is only the prefacelift auto's that use the MD340289 metal case.

however i now have a MD340289 plastic case ECU with a MH7202 processor which i hope is flashable. i can only assume it is some kind of change over model, between prefacelift and facelift.

Yes, it is a picture of my ecu (and I have to check the coating).

I have tried same software / cable to my auto version, that is also pre-facelift, year 97, but haven't opened ecu yet.. and I get identical response when trying to read ecu. I have a feeling it has the same chip, have to check.
I have read many topics, but never met H8/539 chip in any those cases :upsidedow

edit. Picture added where the chip coating can be seen, so it seems to be original !?

Davezj
14-07-2009, 09:35 PM
I have just checked my md340289 plastic case ECU and it seem to be the same as yours in layout terms. i will have a check about to see if i can find any more pics of flashable mf7202 ecu just to check as i seem to have a pic of kenneths ECU and i think it is a 2003 facelift one and a MH7203 chip and it look vastly different to ours.

Davezj
14-07-2009, 09:59 PM
request to all FLASHERS out there,

does anyone have a picture of the ECU PCB of a MH7202 ECU that has been succesfully flashed.

so i can compare the overall layout and board number with the one i have to see if it is a flashable ECU. i want to ensure it is the correct type before i go out and buy a openpport 2.0 cable as they are not cheap.

Thanks in advance

get those pics flowing.

AderC
15-07-2009, 12:27 PM
Dave - I've not got any pics of my ecu and I'm dubious about taking it out given all my recent wiring issues! You're welcome to use my OP2 cable to check things out before you buy though.

aDe

PS I still have your 7201 and TPS's!

Davezj
15-07-2009, 12:52 PM
Cheers aDe i will have to arrange to come over and pick them up. do you still want to do a Rolling road section, or have you done one already. i want to do another one as found some dodgy bits on my turbo pipes. if ther is going to be another one then we can swap bits then.

Legnum
15-07-2009, 01:37 PM
Ecuflash (openport 2.0 / ecuflash 1.42) writes log when reading ecu:

[15:32:27.841] J2534 API Version: 04.04
[15:32:27.841] J2534 DLL Version: 0.50.2598 (DEBUG) Jun 26 2009 15:02:29
[15:32:27.841] Device Firmware Version: 1.07.2597
[15:32:29.944] sending init sequence 2
[15:32:29.944] got 0x10 response instead of 0x11
[15:32:29.944] sending init sequence 3
[15:32:30.305] entering bootloader
[15:32:30.305] sending kernel size (2029)
[15:32:30.315] error sending kernel size
[15:32:30.315] interface close

What kind of log do others get ?

Have any comments (/instructions if something wrong in my setup) about my log ?

AderC
18-07-2009, 02:46 PM
I get this output when flashing mine:

[14:14:40.112] J2534 API Version: 04.04
[14:14:40.112] J2534 DLL Version: 0.50.2598 Jun 26 2009 15:02:29
[14:14:40.112] Device Firmware Version: 1.07.2597
[14:14:50.917] sending init sequence 2
[14:14:50.917] got 0x11 response
[14:14:50.917] sending init sequence 3
[14:14:51.292] entering bootloader
[14:14:51.292] sending kernel size (2029)
[14:14:51.307] sending kernel load address (0x0000F000)
[14:14:51.307] uploading kernel
[14:14:51.635] verifying kernel checksum response
[14:14:51.651] kernel valid
[14:14:51.853] kernel get version
[14:14:51.853] kernel version is : OpenEcu Mitsubishi H8/539F Kernel V1.06
[14:14:51.853] reading kernel comm buffer size
[14:14:51.869] comm buffer size set to 256
[14:14:51.869] reading kernel flash buffer size
[14:14:51.885] flash buffer size set to 1024
[14:14:51.900] -- flashing image to ECU memory --
.
. (lots of stuff while flashing)
.
[14:14:59.622] verifying result...
[14:14:59.622] -- comparing ECU flash memory pages to image file --
[14:14:59.622] seg start len ecu CRC32 img CRC32 same?
[14:14:59.778] LB7 00010000 00003000 AF76F899 AF76F899 YES
[14:14:59.794] SB0 00013000 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:14:59.809] SB1 00013200 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:14:59.825] SB2 00013400 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:14:59.841] SB3 00013600 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:14:59.856] SB4 00013800 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:14:59.872] SB5 00013A00 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:14:59.887] SB6 00013C00 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:14:59.903] SB7 00013E00 00000200 BD7BC39F BD7BC39F YES
[14:15:00.090] LB6 00014000 00004000 F9428341 F9428341 YES
[14:15:00.293] LB5 00018000 00004000 9C038689 9C038689 YES
[14:15:00.496] LB4 0001C000 00004000 690B37D3 690B37D3 YES
[14:15:00.683] LB3 00020000 00004000 3792E004 3792E004 YES
[14:15:00.886] LB2 00024000 00004000 91DCA252 91DCA252 YES
[14:15:01.089] LB1 00028000 00004000 B9B933F1 B9B933F1 YES
[14:15:01.276] LB0 0002C000 00004000 000829C8 000829C8 YES
[14:15:01.276] flash correct! exiting.
[14:15:01.276] interface close

AderC
18-07-2009, 03:03 PM
Had a breakthrough today and found the address for the 2-byte load for the VR-4. Log of ECULoad and 2-byte load from Evoscan below:

/uploaded/1988/1247924897.jpg

Address F0D2 seems to be the one to use.

Edit: I'm confusing myself with all these addresses...you can use either F0D2/F0D3 or F0D8/F0D9 as they appear to give the same value.

aDe

Davezj
18-07-2009, 05:25 PM
you have lost me mate!

is this the value you adjust to change the fuel cut point?

2-byte load, what do this actually do.

AderC
18-07-2009, 06:17 PM
2-byte load is the load value the ECU uses when calculating AFR's etc. The ECUload value logged by Evoscan by default maxes out at 160, whereas the 2-byte load can have values beyond this. If you look at the graph in my previous post you'll see that when I hit max boost (~13.5psi at the mo) the ECUload is flat at 160, whereas the 2-byte load continues right up to 250-ish.

To get Evoscan to log this value a change is needed to the MUT table in the ECU (change the values at MUT00 and MUT01 to f0d2 and f0d3).

"Loads" of info about this if you search the evo forums.

AderC
18-07-2009, 06:22 PM
This is how evoscan describes it:

"Load MUT 2Byte Mod is a reflashed modification to the ECU via EcuFlash and an EvoScan Reprogramming USB Cable. This is a more accurate value, as the ECULoad value clips at 160 load (5*255/8)"

Davezj
18-07-2009, 07:24 PM
cheers aDe thats is useful info. as soon as i get a op2 cable i will be checking out the EVO forums for stuff, and tapping you up for any usefull info you can pass on. but first things first gather some cash together for the cable.

PaddyB
18-07-2009, 08:23 PM
cheers aDe thats is useful info. as soon as i get a op2 cable i will be checking out the EVO forums for stuff, and tapping you up for any usefull info you can pass on. but first things first gather some cash together for the cable.

Is it something we could club together for ?? It's not something that's permanently installed is it ??

foxdie
18-07-2009, 08:41 PM
Agreed, I've been following this thread avidly for a while now (hoping that one day my PFL Auto ECU will be flashable for better performance), I don't mind making a donation to the right person(s) to help move things along :)

MarkSanne
18-07-2009, 10:12 PM
^^what he said^^

kc427
19-07-2009, 08:12 AM
Had a breakthrough today and found the address for the 2-byte load for the VR-4. Log of ECULoad and 2-byte load from Evoscan below:

/uploaded/1988/1247924897.jpg

Address F0D2 seems to be the one to use.

Edit: I'm confusing myself with all these addresses...you can use either F0D2/F0D3 or F0D8/F0D9 as they appear to give the same value.

aDe

Cool..... Thanks a lot, it's really helpful /thankyou

psbarham
19-07-2009, 08:16 AM
Can someone confirm if ecu with the part number MD340290 is out of a vr4 as i have two ecu with the 7202 chip
i also have oone with part number md240289 with the 7202


It dosen't appear to be listed as one of the VR4 ecu's. It's for a N/A Galant 2.5

so does that mean the 2.5's are flashable? if so i have a spare ecu /Hmmm BEN!!!!!! warm the rolling road up /Devil5

kc427
19-07-2009, 08:27 AM
Had a breakthrough today and found the address for the 2-byte load for the VR-4. Log of ECULoad and 2-byte load from Evoscan below:

/uploaded/1988/1247924897.jpg

Address F0D2 seems to be the one to use.

Edit: I'm confusing myself with all these addresses...you can use either F0D2/F0D3 or F0D8/F0D9 as they appear to give the same value.

aDe

aDe,

Just curious, from the log, the 2byte load can be more than 200, but the HiOctaneFuel map has only upto 200 in scale. What will happen if the load is more than 200?

Davezj
19-07-2009, 09:05 AM
Is it something we could club together for ?? It's not something that's permanently installed is it ??

It is a good idea paddy.

maybe the club could buy a few of these open port 2.0 cables and loan them out to people who are willing to put some time and effort into investigating the possibilities of the stock ECU's but the finding would have to be for the members area, due to the unique way they are financed (BBC speak).

it would not be right if these cables were used by members to gain information then start up a business and sell that info. just making a point here. if that was the intention of the investigator then they should buy there own cable.

once some upgrades are available for the ECU then these cables could be loaned out to allow all member to reflash there ECU without having to buy the cable themselves.
i am sure a how to guide could be sent out with the cable also.

there are obviously people on here that make there living from doing remaps and tuning, and i am not suggesting that this is a way to bypass there expertise. As i believe that each car need to be setup on an individual basis and depending on mods.

when i say upgrades i am more talking about shifting fuel cut points and a general capability of leaning off the mixture a fuel points to cut some of the unnecessary over fueling. that the manufactureres have factored in as a belt and bares prtection thing.

i am going a little off topic there but i am not called "Tangental Dave" for nothing.

anyway the club buying a couple of cables. what a good idea.!!!!

:dance: :dance: :dance: :mexicanwav :mexicanwav :mexicanwav :mexicanwav

AderC
19-07-2009, 11:56 AM
aDe,

Just curious, from the log, the 2byte load can be more than 200, but the HiOctaneFuel map has only upto 200 in scale. What will happen if the load is more than 200?

I was wondering whether the formula is evoscan isn't quite right for our cars. I would have thought that the values should actually be the same below loads of 160.

aDe

AderC
19-07-2009, 12:15 PM
I've just looked at this and at loads below 160 the average conversion factor between the ECULoad and 2 byte load as logged is 1.397. Scaling the 2 byte load accordingly gives the following graphs and all values are below 200.

uploaded/1988/1248001935.jpg uploaded/1988/1248002427.jpg

(The "load calculated" is the re-scaled 2 byte load, not to be confused with the evoscan default "load calculated")

If I'm right on this, the 2-byte load formula in Evoscan should be modified from:

0.3125 * x

to

0.2326 * x

in order to log the values correctly on our cars.

AderC
19-07-2009, 12:30 PM
I've just noticed ECUFlash will accept changes to the load scale. Does this mean we could in theory tune to higher loads than 200? See example below where I've upped the max load from 200 to 220:

uploaded/1988/1248002891.jpg uploaded/1988/1248002987.jpg

Nutter_John
19-07-2009, 02:59 PM
Yes that is correct Ade , you basically remove one of the lower lines and adjust the upper ones to give you a broader rangte

kinkyafro
21-07-2009, 12:12 AM
Just read a fantastic ecuflash tuning guide by Merlin in the OZVR4 guides section.

Absolutely essential reading if you planned to remap your car.

Link to guide. (http://ozvr4.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6650)

Davezj
22-07-2009, 09:30 PM
thanks for the link, i have downloaded it and printed it out so will have a perminent record.

it is increadibly detailed and and seem to explain everything from the basics, which is good.

can some of the more active ecu players have a look at the guide and see if it rings true with the stuff you are doing. i am not doubting the greatness of this 82 page god send but i always like a second opinion from other people.

however it looks good, i am up to page 33 and it seems reasonable so far, but that is just reading it, nothing too tricky and seems logical.

AderC
22-07-2009, 10:33 PM
I've gone through it myself and he seems to have done a good job on it. All makes sense to me anyway!

The ECUFlash XML definition doesn't yet have all the tables that are referred to in the guide, but they'll be added once it's 100% certain they're correct.

Davezj
22-07-2009, 10:37 PM
I've gone through it myself and he seems to have done a good job on it. All makes sense to me anyway!

i hoped you would give it the once over and thumbs up would follow.

i will have to read it a few times and start playing with ecuFlash on some dummy Roms and definition files to get used to the format of the software and actually reading the graphs and tables correctly.

Cheers fro the comments aDe.

AderC
22-07-2009, 10:46 PM
You definitely get a better feel for everything when you start playing about with ECUFlash.

I'm looking forward to annoying Vicky with the pop-bang-flame mod as per section 9

kc427
23-07-2009, 04:10 AM
You definitely get a better feel for everything when you start playing about with ECUFlash.

I'm looking forward to annoying Vicky with the pop-bang-flame mod as per section 9

Funny:dance:, does it work?

MarkSanne
23-07-2009, 12:52 PM
I've got the pop-bang-flame already, although not intentionally nor wanted...(sorry for off-topic)

kinkyafro
23-07-2009, 01:00 PM
One thing I'm not understanding even after reading the guide is how to tweak boost levels in ecuflash - seemed straightforward in ecuedit but theres no obvious table to play with in ecuflash.

Can anyone give me a steer?

Beastlee
23-07-2009, 01:01 PM
I've got the pop-bang-flame already, although not intentionally nor wanted...(sorry for off-topic)


I want mine to pop but it doesn't. Hoping a new exhaust will do this.

Due to the completely rubbish weather I still haven't fitted my LC-1 so I can start logging!

Davezj
23-07-2009, 01:21 PM
the guide does seem to suggest that a wideband sensor is a must for tuning performance.

Nutter_John
23-07-2009, 01:43 PM
Yep Dave trying to tune it without a view of the AFR's is like playing russian roulette

kc427
23-07-2009, 02:42 PM
the guide does seem to suggest that a wideband sensor is a must for tuning performance.

and my friend suggests installing EGT gauge as well /haz

Nutter_John
23-07-2009, 02:44 PM
Well yes techincally an EGT is good as you can judge how close to det you are from the temps .

But for the level that most people will do the AFR is an easier value to work with

AderC
23-07-2009, 07:16 PM
One thing I'm not understanding even after reading the guide is how to tweak boost levels in ecuflash - seemed straightforward in ecuedit but theres no obvious table to play with in ecuflash.

Can anyone give me a steer?

The XML definition file isn't complete yet. Should be possible once the maps are properly defined.

kinkyafro
23-07-2009, 10:28 PM
The XML definition file isn't complete yet. Should be possible once the maps are properly defined.


Ahh thanks for the answer thats been bugging me for a few days now. Assumed I was missing something as it's already in the ecuedit definitions. I guess it's more complicated then copying and pasting from the ecuedit defs then.

kinkyafro
24-08-2009, 09:45 PM
Right I'm planning to attempt dumping the M28F102 flash chip. I'll report back with a rom image or WTB:ecu once my stuff arrives from China.


Ok update time...

First of all I wish I'd followed my own advice as the topwin eprom burner does not appear to be compatible as claimed and may have even trashed my ecu flash rom.... :sigh:

anyway I have removed the flash chip, got a socket ready to go on the ECU board and sourced some equivelant flash chips including a one time burnable chip which with the addition of two toggle switches and four wires will (I believe) allow real time switching between 4 different maps.

Unfortunately I'm now at the point where i need to get a better eprom burner from abroad once funds allow at the end of the month so don't expect news anytime soon. Hopefully I'll have something to report in late September.

scott.mohekey
24-08-2009, 10:27 PM
What problems did you have with the eprom burner? Have you considered making one with an avr/pic?

kinkyafro
24-08-2009, 11:16 PM
What problems did you have with the eprom burner? Have you considered making one with an avr/pic?

it refused to recognise the eprom so I obtained a brand new equivelant chip thinking i'd overheated the original during removal which it did exactly the same with - after a bit more diddling around i got a message from my laptop about excessive voltage on the usb port accompanied by a burning smell. at that point I decided against using the topwin anymore :(

as for avr/pics i'm no electronics whizz and don't really know enough but looking at the pins for the 4 megabit prom i have in mind all you have to do is manually switch addressing pins to flick between maps (in principle at least).

I've already got a two megabit one ready to test the theory but need to get a result with a regular 1 mbit first.

scott.mohekey
25-08-2009, 12:00 AM
Either the topwin doesn't support the chip, or the topwin isn't working correctly. An excessive voltage warning over USB from your pc suggests there was probably a short somewhere.

SquattingDog
08-09-2009, 10:32 AM
As far as I know, the 7202 processor can be flashed, but not the 7203.

By the way, my ECU is MD340288 plastic case.

THIS. I have this processor in my RVR X3 ECU case #MD352553. I have an OpenPort 1.3U cable, from EvoScan (Hamish @ Limitless) and can read but not flash my ECU. I have the XML for it, but cannot reflash.

Is there anyone in the North Island (ideally Auckland) who I can come over and use their OpenPort 2.0 cable to attempt a reflash of my ECU before I got out and blow $170USD on one of these cables?

I'm really desperate here guys, have a full set of 800cc injectors and a fuel pump sitting here, waiting to go in ><

dublee
10-09-2009, 10:54 AM
Quick Question,

Can a flashable ecu from a pre-facelift be put into a facelift and from an auto to a manual?

Basically i want to buy a flashable ecu for my facelift manual legnum, will any flashable ecu do?

Turbo_Steve
10-09-2009, 11:00 AM
If you have a facelift manual, you may already have a flashable ECU?

Davezj
10-09-2009, 09:42 PM
as long as it is not too new. the newest facelift (aprox 2001-2003) have the 7203 processor which i don't think is flashable.

but if you have a 1998-2000ish it will be a 7202 processor and you are a lucky lucky boy!

you can flash to hearts content. but not in public you might get arrested.

X-COM
13-10-2009, 07:12 PM
actually 1999 is also equipped with 7203, at least 70% regarding to mitsubishi data. you would like to have early 1998 to be certain that there is 7202 onboard.

enyone cracked already bost pressure settings?
can one share his manual facelift ECU .hex for research purposes?

phosty
06-11-2009, 09:35 PM
Here's a manual ecu rom file - I think it's a PFL though (I bought the ECU).

kc427
08-11-2009, 01:53 PM
Here's a manual ecu rom file - I think it's a PFL though (I bought the ECU).

This is a plastic case ECU(MD340288), right? It's 7202, and you can use it to re-flash :d

Davezj
08-11-2009, 05:02 PM
i have a MD340289 which is a plastic case 7202.
Prior to getting this ECU, i thought all the MD340289 were metal cased 7201 but they are not.

phosty
10-11-2009, 04:57 PM
Yes - it's from a plastic cased MD340288/7202 ecu. I have successfully modified the rpm limits to prove it is reflashable back to a 7202.

However I have a a few rom images (IDs EM2004, EM2005 and a Tuned EM2005 which I believe is from a Mines ECU) that I've pulled of the various forums and done bitwise comparisons - the tables differ a bit as you would expect. But I was working under the assumption (possibly incorrectly) that you could write any of the rom images (i.e. one from a 7203 or the Mines ECUs for example) to one of the 7202 ecus without issue.

Though the chap who has read the eeprom on the 7201 boards seems to suggest that it's rom image is different in structure.

No warranties given or implied though!!! Use at own risk.

GalantOnly
23-11-2009, 02:14 AM
i have a MD340289 which is a plastic case 7202.
Prior to getting this ECU, i thought all the MD340289 were metal cased 7201 but they are not.

/yes

MD340289 for PFL autos
Metal case MH7201FS
Plastic case MH7202F

raph
24-01-2010, 10:05 PM
So ,only the 1998 vr4s are ecuflash flashable then? 7202 roms, and the later 200ß models use the 7203 and are not flashable yet?

elnevio
24-01-2010, 10:13 PM
What you really need to do, is read this thread: http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43786&highlight=7201

Legnum
11-02-2010, 01:40 PM
Are there any changes in definition files (vr4base.xml) and is it possible to update files in this thread?
I found a post in geekmapped where "*Boost Cut Load Limit" was moved from "12228" to address "11d1b"?

Atik
11-02-2010, 01:56 PM
Dont quote me on this, but that sounds familiar. When Ben was remapping my car, he found that the boost cut limit address was incorrect. He moved it to another location and it has since worked fine.

I *think* this might be the same problem, but as I say, I dont know enough about this to advise you any further.

Nutter_John
11-02-2010, 02:11 PM
yeah it is Atik

Legnum
11-02-2010, 02:38 PM
Correct address for boost cut delay is 10378. I have tested. I'm not sure if boost cut address is 1153c, but delay address is enough for me.

TomTom
13-05-2010, 12:24 PM
Hey guys, I need your help!

I've got a 7202 in my automatic Leggy 2000 model and I'm looking for an xml file for it... please forgive me if it's a stupid question ;-)

Patryn999
13-05-2010, 10:50 PM
Hmmm, starting to wonder if it'd be wise to start a thread with latest definitions/stock ROM's and info. I've noticed in my searching that there is at least 5 different boost addresses given, all claimed to be working. Such as:
1153c
12228
11d1b
114b6 (Manual only)
114a6 (Auto only)

Of which so far none seem to have worked for my pfl 1997 7202F. I personally would like to get my hands on a couple of stock roms (both 7202 and 7203's) to see if I can nut out some differences, or alternately if you can flash ROM's into either processor.

Also its very hard to determine which .xml definition file is newer, and painful having to read through 13 (on OZVR4 its up to 30) pages to find whomever has posted latest.

That would require someone with a bit of knowledge to upkeep it though. Don't know if anyone is willing?

EDIT: A sticky thread to be exact :P

TomTom
13-05-2010, 11:34 PM
Definitely agree, those threads need a good clean or good stuff separated!

Anyway, I'm still in the need of the xml file for my Legnum =)

Nutter_John
13-05-2010, 11:38 PM
which xml files have you tried tom

Patryn999
13-05-2010, 11:42 PM
Tom, I think you need the VR4Base.xml and the 2381003 files in the second post in this thread. To the best of my knowledge the legnum and galants are the same ECU.

Then put both in the folder (off the top of my head so may be wrong)
C:\Program Files\OpenEcu\ECUFlash\ModelFiles\Mitsubishi\VR4\

Need to make the "VR4" sub-folder yourself. And remember to unzip the base xml (think its zipped).

Edit: You will need to exit an re-load the application for it to recognise the files you just put in folder.

Nutter_John
13-05-2010, 11:46 PM
why not just put them in the galant folder ?

all the xmls are out there but none of them are fully complete so it is a lot of trail and error , the 7202 are the most complete publicly

TomTom
13-05-2010, 11:46 PM
I haven't tried any yet, I thought its probably better to make sure first... =)

Can anyone else confirm:

VR4Base.xml and the 2381003 files for 2000Legnum auto with 7202ECU ?

Nutter_John
13-05-2010, 11:49 PM
whats the part number of the ecu , this is what determines the internal code

TomTom
13-05-2010, 11:54 PM
It's MD362895 on the plastic case.

Nutter_John
13-05-2010, 11:57 PM
do you have a 2.0 tactrix cable and ecuflash ?

if so you can download the rom image without having the xml defined , once you have downloaded it , upload it here or send me an email john@<this clubs name>.co.uk and i will get you the correct xml

TomTom
14-05-2010, 12:10 AM
No I haven't, but the tuner I'll use has one. Only problem with him is he is a Nissan & Subaru pro and wasn't really keen to go through the lot and therefore asked me if I can get the xml file for it...

He got my ROM on his laptop, I'll ask him if he can send it to me and will get in touch with you, THANKS!

phosty
14-05-2010, 08:36 AM
Hmmm, starting to wonder if it'd be wise to start a thread with latest definitions/stock ROM's and info. I've noticed in my searching that there is at least 5 different boost addresses given, all claimed to be working. Such as:
1153c
12228
11d1b
114b6 (Manual only)
114a6 (Auto only)


Have you tried the last two adddresses yourself? Using the following code in my xmls and changing both tables to 210 allowed me to raise my boost/load cut to 17/18 psi. I confirmed they were the correct tables because setting them to 110 gave me load cut at about 4 psi, and 150 was about 11 psi (as far as I can remember - might be a bit out on those figures). I can't comment on which is for manual/auto as I changed both tables identically.

<table name="#114a6 - Boost/Load limit" category="Turbo" address="114a6" type="2D" scaling="LoadBoost">
<table name="RPM" address="2CD06" type="Y Axis" elements="12" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

<table name="#114b6 - Boost/Load limit" category="Turbo" address="114b6" type="2D" scaling="LoadBoost">
<table name="RPM" address="2CD06" type="Y Axis" elements="12" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

taylor
14-05-2010, 09:19 AM
Carl. I believe we will have the same ecu (98 pfl galant)

Be really good to have someone down here that knows how to do some basic tuning.

I wonder if its worth speaking to kenneth. he may even have a map we could use (ie raised boost cut)

Probably not going to do too much untill I get a wideband..

Hmmm, starting to wonder if it'd be wise to start a thread with latest definitions/stock ROM's and info. I've noticed in my searching that there is at least 5 different boost addresses given, all claimed to be working. Such as:
1153c
12228
11d1b
114b6 (Manual only)
114a6 (Auto only)

Of which so far none seem to have worked for my pfl 1997 7202F. I personally would like to get my hands on a couple of stock roms (both 7202 and 7203's) to see if I can nut out some differences, or alternately if you can flash ROM's into either processor.

Also its very hard to determine which .xml definition file is newer, and painful having to read through 13 (on OZVR4 its up to 30) pages to find whomever has posted latest.

That would require someone with a bit of knowledge to upkeep it though. Don't know if anyone is willing?

EDIT: A sticky thread to be exact :P

Patryn999
14-05-2010, 11:49 AM
Yeah I've been holding off dicking around too much myself until it arrives.

Phosty - I did a quick drive lowering both of those to 120ish and still boosted up to 12psi, so don't think it worked. However I had it set to map RPM from different address, so maybe that is what screwed mine up. Table data now looks a little more valid. Afraid I can't confirm for another week until we have our CHCH meet and I get a new diff :P My previous logging for about 10 mins of thrashing it kept octane rating at 100 with no counts of knock, so be interested to see what it does when I have wideband & time. And fuel. Lots of fuel.

Fingers crossed wideband'll've arrived by then, but I doubt it! sigh. I had to go and get a toy instead, trying out the SLC-DIY wideband kit. Mainly because I had aspirations of putting EGT probes in at some stage as well.

Looking at hacking together a small module at the moment to convert SLC's serial input into a virtual comport and fake the LM-1 protocol so Evoscan will not know the difference.

Sorry, got side-tracked there. Well, when car's back on the road I'll drop an update, hopefully sort out something for me and Taylor to play with ;)

taylor
14-05-2010, 12:45 PM
Looking at hacking together a small module at the moment to convert SLC's serial input into a virtual comport and fake the LM-1 protocol so Evoscan will not know the difference.

Sorry, got side-tracked there. Well, when car's back on the road I'll drop an update, hopefully sort out something for me and Taylor to play with ;)

Mince :D

How come you didnt just go with the tried and tru LC - 1

evonut270
15-05-2010, 06:41 PM
Hmmm, starting to wonder if it'd be wise to start a thread with latest definitions/stock ROM's and info. I've noticed in my searching that there is at least 5 different boost addresses given, all claimed to be working. Such as:
1153c
12228
11d1b
114b6 (Manual only)
114a6 (Auto only)

Of which so far none seem to have worked for my pfl 1997 7202F. I personally would like to get my hands on a couple of stock roms (both 7202 and 7203's) to see if I can nut out some differences, or alternately if you can flash ROM's into either processor.

Also its very hard to determine which .xml definition file is newer, and painful having to read through 13 (on OZVR4 its up to 30) pages to find whomever has posted latest.

That would require someone with a bit of knowledge to upkeep it though. Don't know if anyone is willing?

EDIT: A sticky thread to be exact :PRoms can be flashed into either processor as long as you mod the XML prior to writing and use he correct dropdown in ecuflash if using the 7203

phosty
25-05-2010, 09:07 PM
Patryn999, assuming those axis I gave are correct (I got the xml code from http://www.geekmapped.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1532 so can't claim them myself) then you should see a curve that looks like this:

uploaded/4134/1274817721.jpg

or graphically:

uploaded/4134/1274817746.jpg

Is that what you see? They worked for me so I don't know why lowering it to 120 wouldn't have made you cut sooner. Have you tried again?

bradc
25-05-2010, 09:08 PM
That low point at 3000 is particularly worrying considering how they love to make boost right at that point!

scott.mohekey
25-05-2010, 09:12 PM
That could be to smooth out boost spikes.

Nutter_John
25-05-2010, 09:13 PM
Yep also it is also to keep it below fuel cut

phosty
25-05-2010, 09:15 PM
I kind of read it like it's a bump at 2000 rather than a dip at 3000 precisely to avoid the cut when the boost spikes initially.

I guess that people used to work around it by limiting the boost until above 4500 rpm?

Patryn999
26-05-2010, 11:05 AM
Yeah, the numbers seem to match. I haven't had a chance to try it, as just got the diff replaced and I'm waiting to stop *(#king raining before I bleed it and start tinkering again. Want to get wideband in as well, the rain monster is currently winning the battle with my motivation. Come on sun...

Patryn999
28-05-2010, 02:29 AM
Also its probably a bit much to ask, but does anyone have a rom for fuel pump/ decat/ 3" exhaust/upped boost? I have evoscan and wideband so have fall-backs. Just wondering if I could save myself some time/gas :P

lyndon
09-06-2010, 03:19 AM
Hmmm, starting to wonder if it'd be wise to start a thread with latest definitions/stock ROM's and info. I've noticed in my searching that there is at least 5 different boost addresses given, all claimed to be working. Such as:
1153c
12228
11d1b
114b6 (Manual only)
114a6 (Auto only)

Of which so far none seem to have worked for my pfl 1997 7202F. I personally would like to get my hands on a couple of stock roms (both 7202 and 7203's) to see if I can nut out some differences, or alternately if you can flash ROM's into either processor.

Also its very hard to determine which .xml definition file is newer, and painful having to read through 13 (on OZVR4 its up to 30) pages to find whomever has posted latest.

That would require someone with a bit of knowledge to upkeep it though. Don't know if anyone is willing?

EDIT: A sticky thread to be exact :P

starting a new thread will be great. cuz right now i'm looking for an updated hex and xml for a 7202 ecu

Anza69
01-07-2010, 06:55 AM
Can some one help me with ECU Flash? I can't get it work with my car's *.HEX file. I finaly get it show some maps, but the numbers and tabels are a mess. I think the adress are wrong. I opened the ecu when i got the car and it haves chip 7202F, but i lost the picture of it and i don't remember the case code. ASA says it is MD359138 and it is blastic case. The car is Legnum VR-4 -99 Auto FL.

Patryn999
01-07-2010, 07:50 AM
Can you post the .hex file? Might have a few people on here who can look at it and see if we can make heads or tails of it.

Anza69
01-07-2010, 07:59 AM
Thanx :2thumbsup I try to find the file at work, but if i can't find it in here i post it when i get home :2thumbsup

Anza69
01-07-2010, 04:59 PM
Here is the file. I's zip:ped with winrar

Patryn999
02-07-2010, 12:39 AM
Seems to be a slightly different memory configuration, Think I've tracked down boost cut, fuel high/low, wastegate stuff, open loop load, timing high/low and cat table.

But I'm doing this at work :P so should probably start actually doing something before someone gets suspicious. I'll try to confirm stuff when I get home and give you something you can play with.

scott.mohekey
02-07-2010, 12:55 AM
I had a look at it this morning before work. I have a hex dump from another ecu with the same case id, and it has a rom id of EM23xx I think, while the one you've uploaded was EM34xx (I may have them back to front). It might be easier for you to just use an existing known rom on your ecu.

Patryn999
02-07-2010, 01:13 AM
His is an EM2381.

Any idea why they changed it so much? I know people say that all roms are compatable, but it just bugs the crap out of my as to why they would change it (ROM hex dump is quite different). The release proceedures on something like ECU code are rediculous (regression testing, reviews, MISRA inpections. etc.), and the processor is the same (I believe) so it just begs as to why they changed it.

I'm not suggesting that they are not compatible (people have tested!) but I have a hankering to know what changed... haha.

scott.mohekey
02-07-2010, 01:16 AM
Ah, then the one I have from the same case id is an EM24xx.

It would be interesting to see if two ecus with the same case id, but different rom ids are actually physically identical.

crazyken76
02-07-2010, 01:22 AM
i give in

Patryn999
02-07-2010, 02:10 AM
Ah, then the one I have from the same case id is an EM24xx.

It would be interesting to see if two ecus with the same case id, but different rom ids are actually physically identical.

Indeed, because if it is just the firmware then it begs the question of why it was updated, given all the hassle of meeting MISRA compliance (Called MISRAble at the last place I worked at ;) ) If there wasn't a significant benefit.

A change in hardware could also be that they employed different hardware filtering or some such, which would mean that while the older software would work, it may be some further improvements were made (to firmware) given the newer hardware?

This is al conjecture, and finding out the real reason for changes will probably end up being more effort than its worth :P Wouldn't be the first time I heard something like "Oh yeah, we had to change that cause we couldn't buy that specific component anymore." and I've had to make a few of those changes myself.

Patryn999
02-07-2010, 07:29 AM
I gotta scram tonight so I'll give you what I've done in the mean time, it inherites from vr4base1, which is on here somewhere if you don't have it. Otherwise the maps that look right are:
Fuel high/low
Open loop load
Boost cut x 2 (1 for auto, 1 for manual according to Russians)
Boost desired engine load
WGDC
Ignition maps High/Low
Cat ignition maps.

Although all that it inherits seems to have wrong RPM/LOAD addresses, but right table index, Rev and speed limit seem to be same from vr4base1 xml definitions. Data from tables I listed above matches my EM2005 ECU, so seems legit.

P.S - remove the .pdf extension when you go to use it. Had to add it to upload.

Anza69
02-07-2010, 02:14 PM
Thanks to you /notworthy /notworthy

Now i have to go test this system :bananadan

SWEET!

Anza69
08-07-2010, 09:43 AM
It works /woot2 I put thr rev. limitter to 2800rpm and it works. Then back to 7300 rpms and works again YES!

I remoaved the speed limiter to 320 so no worrys abaut that. And i tested in a closed area the speed meter goes on the whats the thing that shows how many kilometers you being driven on the bottom of speed meter. I think speed was about 200km/h /woot

Thanx to you guyes your the best

Shtiv
19-10-2010, 12:46 AM
In case someone looks here for the latest defs, I have found most of the xml files to have the wrong axis on the fuel maps, well the correct ais but the wrong way around! they should be swapped using a swapxy=true bit of code.... Yes I have tested this.

<table name="Fuel Map 1 - HI OCTANE #1" category="Fuel and Ignition Maps" address="110a3" type="3D" swapxy="true" scaling="AFR">
<table name="Load" address="2cf54" type="X Axis" elements="15" scaling="Load"/>
<table name="RPM" address="2cf30" type="Y Axis" elements="15" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

<table name="Fuel Map 2 - HI OCTANE #2" category="Fuel and Ignition Maps" address="1118b" type="3D" swapxy="true" scaling="AFR">
<table name="Load" address="2cf54" type="X Axis" elements="15" scaling="Load"/>
<table name="RPM" address="2cf30" type="Y Axis" elements="15" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

<table name="Fuel Map 3 - LO OCTANE #1" category="Fuel and Ignition Maps" address="11273" type="3D" swapxy="true" scaling="AFR">
<table name="Load" address="2d1ce" type="X Axis" elements="15" scaling="Load"/>
<table name="RPM" address="2cf30" type="Y Axis" elements="15" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

<table name="Fuel Map 4 - LO OCTANE #2" category="Fuel and Ignition Maps" address="1135b" type="3D" swapxy="true" scaling="AFR">
<table name="Load" address="2d1ce" type="X Axis" elements="15" scaling="Load"/>
<table name="RPM" address="2cf30" type="Y Axis" elements="15" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

sampsulo
20-10-2010, 02:41 PM
hi, i having an issue, got 1999 vr4, open port 2.0 and the latest ecuflash. i cant get the definiton files to load after reading the rom from the ecu. when defining the new rom what start address do i use?

Madden
20-10-2010, 04:44 PM
hi, i having an issue, got 1999 vr4, open port 2.0 and the latest ecuflash. i cant get the definiton files to load after reading the rom from the ecu. when defining the new rom what start address do i use?

I just had the same problem mate.

Go to options:

Directories: metadata directory: Then browse and it should come up with this : C:/Program Files/OpenECU/EcuFlash/rommetadata/mitsubishi/galant

sampsulo
21-10-2010, 09:49 PM
im getting an error when i try flash...blank memory page: addres 010000
do i have to remove my ecu to get the rom id?

mxc357
13-11-2022, 01:50 AM
I am having issues with the car running after flashing. I have a 97 PFL with a 7201ecu, I replaced it with a 7202. The member I purchased from says the ecu was tuned for an FTO single turbo. I have flashed the ecu with the attached files but when I start the car no tachometer and after 10 seconds car starts to sound like a machine gun.
83674
83675
83676
83677