Dereks ideas

[enigma]

Derek and I had plenty of time to chat cars yesterday and he came up with an interesting idea. Now it seems someone beat him to it but what do you chaps reckon...............

Water Cooled Brakes (http://www.autospeed.com/cms/article.html?&A=0589)

[Nick Mann]

Sounds interesting.... But surely more expensive to set up than better normal brakes?

[enigma]

1 washer bottle
2 nozzles
1 controller

£30

1 set of Kad 6 pots £1500

Hang on I seem to be £1470 richer!!

[Nick Mann]

LOL!

Okay - sorry, forgot about BDA fabrications, Ltd. :$

[Brind]

:headsc:

Air cooling and heat dissipation and size is always the winner surely? as it allows gradual heating and cooling whereas spraying the brakes could cool to quickly, glaze the metal, harden and make brittle the discs.. exteme cases I'm sure..

[SGHOM]

Made a start on my little mod this evening, by procuring some uneeded item's from project VX :$ :$
one washer bottle, one washer pump, [ KIERAN !!! WHERE IS IT ??? ] :headsc: and the few ft of rubber hose to the washer jets.
plan is............. mount the washer bottle in the passenger footwell along with pump. get a 12V feed to it via a kill switch, dash mounted. & then run the switched supply from the 'switched' side of the brake pedal. [ electrical speak !!! I know what I'm on about ! :$ ]
The hose will then be routed to each brake disc, & fine jet nozzles attached, & directed at the disc. This way & need only activate it when needed, & only under braking. The theory is that the brakes will, hopefully, not be too hot when I hit the pedal & activate the 'mist' spray.
Uprated fluid & braided hoses should then see an improvement in brake performance !! :rolleyes5 & god knows I need it after the last trip to castle combe ! :sad3:

[Simon]

boys and their toys! :p just dont fill the bottle with the contents of a WD40 can! :$ .................... :rolleyes5

[SGHOM]

I would like bigger & better brakes Simon, but I ain't got £2K lying around !! :rolleyes5 so this is the next best alternative. If it works.............. :-D :-D If it dont, It's cost me nothing !!!
I was thinking more of COOL BLUE in the washer bottle ?? would that work better ?? :lipsrseal :$

[colVR4]

okay, heres one from me! I don't know diddly-squat about engineering so bear with me.

Right, you have turbos that run off the exhaust gases from the engine to force more air into the engine, but these suffer from lag until you get the engine speeds up. Then there are superchargers which run directly off the engine via a belt or similar. These have the advantage of having the increase in air from lower revs. Am I right so far?

Has anybody actually combined the two into one component that is both directly driven AND exhaust driven..a kind of supercharged turbo. At lower revs the force needed comes directly from the belt drive and then changes over as the revs increase to be driven by the exhaust gases. You could employ some kind of clutch to switch between the two.

What do you think? I bet this has already been done though right? :dozey:

[Roadrunner]

I bet this has already been done though right?
Yep, 1985/86 Lancia Delta S4 Stradale:

Driveline : longitudinal engine at centre/rear with four wheel drive
Engine : 1759cc (88.5x71.5mm) 16v dohc 4cyl supercharged and turbocharged with 250bhp @ 6,750rpm, dry sump lubrication, Weber IAW injection, Marelli ignition
Suspension front : double wishbone with telescopic dampers and coil springs
rear : double wishbone with twin telescopic dampers and coil springs
wheels & tyres (front & rear) : 8x16" rims with 205/55 VR16
wheelbase : 2440mm
track (front/rear) : 1500mm / 1520mm
Brakes front : discs, ventilated, diameter 300mm
rear : discs, ventilated, diameter 300mm
mechanical handbrake on the rear callipers
Steering Rack and pinion with vacuum servo, 2.75 turns lock-to-lock
Gearbox 5 speed manual (ZF)
Weight 1200kg
distribution (front/rear) : 43.75% / 56.25%

[colVR4]

Bu66er!!

[Japmetal]

They even have a snazzy name for this kind of turbo/supercharger working in tandem - Compound Charging :-b

[colVR4]

So how come that's the only car that it has been used on? I have looked for it elsewhere and all the links go to that car?

Surely the technology must be there to make this viable. I was thinking that you could have a spinny-fan-thingy that is free to turn as fast as it wants but at slower speeds would be turned by the connection from the engine-pulley-thingy...a bit like the back spindle on a mountain bike. As you can tell I am not an engineer so I don't know how feasable this would be.

[Brind]

Probably the same as most things, price and reliability, anything too complex becomes a liability if you can achive the same if not better in other ways.

[Japmetal]

As has been said; it's expensive [think about the cost of just buying a decent turbo, or a decent 'charger and you have to buy BOTH !], has limited advantage over the use of one or other type of forced induction, and from what I understand is an absolute AR$£ to get set up & running properly :rolleyes5

[colVR4]

Well I have designed a compound charging unit that I am going to patent and make in my garage and it is going to make me loads of money and I'm going to keep it all to myself and take over the world MWHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHH!!! :rolleyes5

[enigma]

That would be fine but for one thing, the turbo generally spins at 100,000rpm or more, your ratchet would last approximately 3 minutes 26.42 seconds!

I am sure a similar system is used on a compound charger.

[colVR4]

Yes, but thats twice as long as Vauxhall parts last and nearly ten times as long as TVR's :-D

Anyway the ratchet would be titanium or something and the spring would be a heat-resistant rubber compound and.... oh, alright its cr*p

[enigma]

With some development it certainly has options......................... :D