ICE install problem - getting interference

[bamakin]

Hi help would be appreciated on this one on my 1997 leggie. Its got the old black japanese amp in the boot which all the speakers seem to run through with factory fitted sub.
I am installing my own headunit/amp and wiring speakers to the amp but just starting with some 6 by 9's on diy parcel shelf and some rear door speakers for now just to get some sounds out before moving to front components.
Amp is JBL GTO4000 - 600 watts 3/4 channel to alpine stereo with 2 pre outs on it. Amp is in boot and earthed in boot. everything wired in and music coming through but am getting interference which is pretty quiet with one set of rca leads plugged into amp and headunit, with both sets of leads plugged in for front and rear i get loud interference, a constant high pitched tone.
I am not an ICE wizard but can wire up basic system and am only using cheap leads and cables but have used these before with same amp no problem.
Im wondering if the interference is coming from headunit itself, the amp or some nearby electrical interference?
Any one got any ideas?

Thanks.

[Johny]

are the RCAs and the power cable touching?

[bamakin]

Yes when they enter the compartment in the boot where my amp is installed they do touch they go through same hole. Is that the problem would you say?
When its light again tomorrow i will check this.
Thank you.

[Gly]

how is the head unit earthed?
chassis or factory wiring, i find the factory earth pretty ****, and a nice new clean chassis earth is much better,

aslo what other non factory electric items are in the car

[VR457]

I have been getting interference for some time but have not had the time to sort it. New wiring for the headunit and looking at the earthing point for the amp are on the list of things to do. Incidentally, it has been suggested that the proximity of the RCA and power leads causing interference is a bit of an urban myth.

[Pugme]

lol, nope its no myth, RCA cables and power cables shoudl be run down opposite sides of the car

[bamakin]

how is the head unit earthed?
chassis or factory wiring, i find the factory earth pretty ****, and a nice new clean chassis earth is much better,

aslo what other non factory electric items are in the car

The head unit is earthed to the metal frame behind the stereo / air con unit which i thought was bolted to chassis, it looked ok but will have a look at it. I will also try re-routing rca cables and power further away from each other. Reason I was a bit stumped was I have had the same install on a few different cars but never had interference. There is nothing else electrical non factory in the car unless its the jap amp. As I have only disconnected its cables and i assume it only takes power if the factory headunit was fitted and switched on.

[Gly]

it doesn't necessarily need to be an install problem,

could be a issue with spark plug leads/coil pack, or the alternators rectifier breaking down?
id also be looking at the engine bays earthing points and leads,

[VR457]

lol, nope its no myth, RCA cables and power cables shoudl be run down opposite sides of the car

http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/4/319301.html

http://forums.thecarlounge.com/showthread.php?1849983-Myth-worth-it-to-run-speaker-wire-on-oppisite-side-from-power-wire

Different viewpoints on just that...

[Pugme]

its like a geek war!! :)

well whether it does or doesnt, fact or fiction, persoanlly i wouldnt run my power cables with my rca's i spose its just one of them things! :D

[c0xxy]

well whether it does or doesnt, fact or fiction, persoanlly i wouldnt run my power cables with my rca's i spose its just one of them things! :D

nor me! did it in a mondeo i had once, and as the revs went up a high pitch whine got louder with it... cured by moving the cables from each other!

[CANDEE]

nor me! did it in a mondeo i had once, and as the revs went up a high pitch whine got louder with it... cured by moving the cables from each other!

Ive never had an issue in either of my VR's having power next to RCA's. :) I had 2AWG power wire going along next to my RCA's in my leggie for ages.. lol

[c0xxy]

iv done it in cars before the mondy with out trouble. haven't done it since to save risk of having to redo everything.
gly was probably spot on!

[VR457]

its like a geek war!! :) :D

You know it makes sense....:upsidedow

[CANDEE]

iv done it in cars before the mondy with out trouble. haven't done it since to save risk of having to redo everything.
gly was probably spot on!

I usually run extra grounds off the battery too, so that might just help too... lol

[c0xxy]

I usually run extra grounds off the battery too, so that might just help too... lol

yeah, i had a diagram for one of them earthing kits knocking round somewhere. was planning on doing it myself. which brings me to another thought. if relocating the battery to the boot, is it worth putting a grounding kit in?
sorry to be hi-jacking!
ash

[Gly]

you would need to run the earths from the neg terminal, so would require a **** load of cable. (to get the the engine bay)

as a rule of thumb, the earth should be twice the size of the positive,

i have the battery in the boot in my blue vr4, i only have one very large earth cable to the chassis in the boot,
and a large audio install with no noise issues

[c0xxy]

you would need to run the earths from the neg terminal, so would require a **** load of cable. (to get the the engine bay)

as a rule of thumb, the earth should be twice the size of the positive,

i have the battery in the boot in my blue vr4, i only have one very large earth cable to the chassis in the boot,
and a large audio install with no noise issues

kool, cheers for that!
ash

[Fully]

The Ten Commandments

I. The best cure is prevention. I can't overemphasize this point. If you've ever spent an entire weekend tearing an installation apart in order to eliminate some noise, you know what I mean. Take the time to sketch the system out before you begin the install. This graphic representation of the installation will help you to avoid introducing ground loops and will serve as a road map for eliminating noise if it is present.

II. Don't introduce ground loops. Ground loops are created whenever an audio ground is established at more than one location. Theoretically, the only place the audio ground should be connected to the chassis ground is at the source unit. In my experience, I've found that in systems that have noise problems, a ground loop is the culprit nine times out of ten.

III. Never run signal wires alongside power cables. This is especially true in installations where high powered amplifiers are used. Large amplifiers are capable of drawing large currents. These currents vary with the musical demand of the program material as does the electromagnetic field surrounding the power cable. The more current that flows through the wire, the bigger this field becomes. If audio cables are located in close proximity to this fluctuating electromagnetic field, noise could be induced into the system.

IV. Always use 100% shielded audio cable. This will insure maximum protection against induced noises by power cables and other sources of electromagnetic interference. Good audio cables are not cheap. If you prefer to make your own cables, I would recommend using a wire with a foil shield surrounded by a drain wire.

V. Never use the ground wire in the vehicle's OEM radio harness. This wire usually makes a very poor ground due to it's length, small wire gauge, close proximity to other power wires, and unknown termination point. Instead, ground the source unit directly to the chassis or firewall.

VI. Make sure the amplifiers have a good audio ground reference. In order for the amps to function properly, the audio ground must be referenced to chassis ground at the source unit. If it is not, the amplifier could oscillate. To check for a good ground reference, take a volt-ohm meter (VOM) and measure the resistance between the chassis of the radio and the shield of the RCA line level outputs of the radio. This reading should indicate a direct short. If this is not the case, grounding the shield of the RCA line level outputs to the chassis of the radio will probably be necessary.

VII. Keep amplifier power ground wires as short as possible. The longer a wire, the more resistance it has. When a current flows through a resistance, a voltage drop is produced. Because of this, the ground reference at the amplifier's circuit board is no longer the same as that at the chassis of the vehicle. This ground potential differential can lead to noise and improper operation of the amp.

VIII. Don't connect all of your amplifier ground wires under one bolt. Contrary to belief, this is not required if the rest of the system is installed properly. If you do connect more than one power ground wire under a single bolt, you run the risk of amplifier ground modulation. This is caused by the current demands of, for example a woofer amp, modulating the power ground wire of a tweeter amp. This results in a squeaking noise that can be heard over the tweeters whenever bass notes hit.

IX. Make sure all levels are set correctly. Level setting is a critical part of the installation process. If done properly, maximum system signal to noise ratio can be obtained. Keep in mind that you want to drive the audio cables that feed the amps in the rear of the car as hard as possible. To do this, reduce the gain of the amplifiers to minimum. Turn up the volume on the source unit to 80% of maximum. Now adjust the input sensitivity of the amplifiers upward until the maximum intended loudness is obtained.

X. Noise filters can only reduce noise, not eliminate it. A noise filter is just that, a filter. And like any other filter (crossover network, etc.), it works by modification, not elimination. Some installers rely on filters heavily. In some instances a filter may prove necessary, but I believe that if the system is installed properly, a filter is usually not required.

About now most of you are probably making strange faces and saying "Now you tell me!" Well, all is not lost. If you have already installed your auto sound system and are unfortunate enough to have some noise, here are a few suggestions on where to look and what to do.

Alternator Whine
To me, alternator whine is the most annoying form of noise. For those of you who are lucky enough never to have been exposed to alternator whine, it sounds like a miniature siren that rises in pitch with the speed of the engine. Alternator whine is almost always caused by a ground loop. The following steps will aid you in locating and correcting a ground loop problem.

Verify that all levels are set properly.
With the system turned off, unplug the RCA inputs to the amplifier.
Start the vehicle and turn the system on. If the noise is gone go to step 8. If the noise is still present, it is coming from the amp or the speaker wiring. Continue.
Turn the system off and disconnect the speaker harness.
Start the engine and verify that no noise is present. In a few rare instances, I have actually heard speakers reproduce noise without being connected to an amplifier. This noise was being induced by power cables that were very close to the speaker wire. If you do have this type of noise, reroute the appropriate speaker lead and go to step 3.
With the speaker harness still disconnected, check to make sure there are no shorts between the speaker leads and the chassis of the vehicle. A shorted negative speaker lead will create a ground loop by establishing a second audio ground reference point. If you do have a short, trace the wire out and repair it then go to step 3.
With the RCA inputs and speaker harness still disconnected from the amplifier, use your VOM to measure from the shield of the RCA jacks on the amp to the chassis of the vehicle. This reading should not be a direct short (100 ohms or more is acceptable.) If this reading does indicate a direct short, you might have a defective amp and should contact the manufacturer for verification. (Note that there are a few "inexpensive" amps or boosters on the market that have their audio ground and electrical ground commoned internally. For units of this type, the information in this article will be of very little value.)
If you've made it here, you know that the amplifier and speaker wiring are okay.
Connect the accessories in front of the amp (crossovers, equalizers, etc.) one at a time and check for alternator whine. When each device is tested, there should be nothing plugged into the input of that device. In this way, we will work toward the source unit piece by piece. Be sure to turn the system power off before connecting or disconnecting any cables or accessories.
Repeat step 9 until all accessories have been tested.
If a particular accessory is causing noise, try disconnecting it's power ground wire. Go to step 9.
Now it's time to connect the source unit. Do that now and test for noise.
If noise is present, try unplugging the antenna. If the noise goes away, you will need to use an antenna isolator. This little gismo opens the shield wire of the coax to eliminate the ground loop caused by the ground at the antenna.
If you still have noise, try connecting the source unit's ground wire in another location,. preferably as close to the source unit as possible.
Does the noise vary in amplitude when you adjust the volume control? If it does, the problem is probably power line related and not a ground loop. If this is the case, run the source unit's B+ (yellow) wire directly to the positive terminal of the battery. If this doesn't do the trick, you will probably have to use a power line filter on the source unit's B+ (Yel) and Ignition (Red) wires.

Ignition Noise
Ignition noise is another type of noise that is quite annoying. It usually sounds like a popping or buzzing sound whenever the engine is running. The best cure is to remove the motor but since we can't do that, we will have to rely on some other form of remedy. Follow the steps below to eliminate or reduce ignition noise.

Make sure you are using resistor type spark plugs and resistor type plug wires.
Determine where the noise is coming from. If the noise is a popping sound that occurs 2 or 3 times a second, you probably have a loose or bad plug wire. First, make sure that all plug wires are seated properly. If this doesn't do the trick, you may have a bad plug wire. Usually this occurs due to a pinhole in the insulation of the wire. Whenever the plug wire is energized, an arc jumps through the pinhole to the chassis of the vehicle. Replace with silicone resistor plug wires.
If the noise is a buzzing sound, the problem is usually associated with the points, distributor, or coil. Try replacing the condenser on both the coil and points. Make sure all plug wires are seated properly in the distributor cap. Additionally, you might try adding a 2200 uF cap from the positive terminal on the coil to chassis ground.
Don't use the fuse block in the vehicle to derive power for the source unit. Run the Constant Hot B+ (memory) wire directly to the battery's positive terminal.
If you still have noise, it could be occurring because of induction. Try pulling the source unit out of the dash and check for noise. If the noise is eliminated, try rerouting any wiring harnesses that are close to the deck. If this is not possible, try using self adhesive metal shielding. This might just do the trick.

Turn On/Off Thump.
Turn on thump can vary from a slight pop to a mind shattering, teeth rattling BOOM! This thump is caused by the audio circuitry stabilizing when power is applied. Most amplifiers and source units have muting circuitry that lasts a couple of seconds to allow these fluctuations to subside before passing a signal. However, if the amplifier un-mutes before the source unit or any other accessory, you better watch out. Here are some things to try if you have turn on thump.

Verify that the amp has a good audio ground reference. (See rule 6 of the Ten Commandments of noise free installation.)
Don't install the system so the amplifiers can be switched on when the source unit is turned off.
If you still have thump, add a turn on delay module in line with the remote turn on wire to the amp.
This concludes the section on turn on thump.

System Hiss
Hiss is usually most noticeable over the midrange and tweeters. The reasons for this are simple. The human ear is more sensitive to the frequencies reproduced by these drivers. Mids and tweets are usually far more efficient than their low frequency counterparts. And, these drivers are usually mounted closer to the listener. If you have hiss, you probably have your levels set improperly. See rule 9 of the Ten Commandments of noise free installation.

While I know that I haven't covered all the forms of noise or even all of the methods of dealing with it, I hope that I've made a good start. By adhering to the Ten Commandments and investing a little persistence, you will be rewarded with a noise free installation.

[c0xxy]

crikey, thats brilliant!

[Patryn999]

One other thing to check (I did read the huge-ass amount of text, but I thought I'd say it directly) is to make sure that the RCA surround on the plugs is actually contacting on both the amp and head-unit side. I had a good one once where the RCA plug outer wasn't actually contacting the socket; this meant that the small-signal ground was referenced through the chassis instead, which introduced alternator noise. Bit of a chomp down on connector to make it more oval (and thus touch) and we were away laughing.

[bamakin]

One other thing to check (I did read the huge-ass amount of text, but I thought I'd say it directly) is to make sure that the RCA surround on the plugs is actually contacting on both the amp and head-unit side. I had a good one once where the RCA plug outer wasn't actually contacting the socket; this meant that the small-signal ground was referenced through the chassis instead, which introduced alternator noise. Bit of a chomp down on connector to make it more oval (and thus touch) and we were away laughing.

I will check this out tomorrow thanks. I have got the interference right down now but its still present, but I only have rca to front channel on amp as when i add the rca cable to the rear channel the interference jumps up substantially. I have re-routed cables to make sure power lead is well away but made no difference. I also check all ground points. I noticed that the aerial was acting as a ground and also the headunit has its own ground so was not sure if I had created a ground loop there but made no difference when removing aerial connection. I also wondered if my 2nd rca cable is dodgy but i swapped them around and both work on either the front output or rear output ok with minimal interference (although still there slightly) but when both rca's are plugged in to headunit and amp the interference jumps up again.
Could it be the headunit playing up maybe??
Or maybe I need to buy more expensive leads? Just dont want to spend unneccesarily.

PS thanks to everyone who has replied to this thread! would be lost otherwise lol!!

[Gly]

what sort of head unit?
are the rca's internally fused on the heard unit?
i know some HU's had this and when the fuse went you would get feedback,

you can test this by shorting the rca neg to the body of the headunit

[bamakin]

what sort of head unit?
are the rca's internally fused on the heard unit?
i know some HU's had this and when the fuse went you would get feedback,

you can test this by shorting the rca neg to the body of the headunit

its one similar to this:
http://www.caraudiocentre.co.uk/product_m-alpine-cde-112ri_p-25868.htm

When i touch the rca.s to the rear of the head unit body i get feedback noise.
I have quite a few times checked to make sure rca's have solid connection but need to check metal surround is actually contacting.
There is a fuse on the back of the head unit although i have never actually checked it!!

I will have another look when daylight cometh!!!

Just strange cos used same system on few different cars but this is only one getting interference.
Small price to pay though for having an awesome VR-4!!

[Fully]

Another option is to run your unit on a bench!

I normally do this on big job I have done in the past. Just to make sure nothing is faulty.

[bamakin]

Another option is to run your unit on a bench!

I normally do this on big job I have done in the past. Just to make sure nothing is faulty.

I wish I had done this now eh!!!
Will definately do it next time. Keep trying to get out to work on car but now its covered in snow!! This must be worlds longest job!

[wintertidenz]

The Pioneer units usually have a fusable RCA fuse that goes if you plug it in while the unit is powered on, not sure about the Alpines though.

Cheap leads can cause issues, another way of doing it would be to solder a ground to the outside of the RCA's on each end and ground them that way. Also check that there is no voltage or resistance differential in the grounds between the front and the rear of the car - if so, then you will get noise.

I would also suggest making a nice big ground off your battery as well if you are installing a larger system, or are going for SQ - just helps to eliminate any issues with your older factory ground.

[bamakin]

Whats the best way to ground the headunit as I now need to remove the wiring loom adapter ground and replace it with decent cable which is the same as I have used to ground the amp in the boot.
Can you just make a connection to the headunit body anywhere suitable? ie where screw can be fitted.

Cheers.

[VR457]

Best ground is to take a line direct to the battery terminal (-).

Pugme is right about checking RCA connections are secure on both sides.

The best way is to test each item in isolation on a test bench but failing that it's a case of trying different things and seeing what happens. One solution for a whiny BMW mentioned in Talkaudio was to wire in a capacitor between the battery and chassis!

[pitslayer]

Tin foil hat?

[wintertidenz]

Ground it on the metal chassis, either under a screw or somewhere else suitable. Then run it down to a point on the chassis, sand it down to bare metal, bolt it in, and just lightly paint over the top (to prevent corrosion).

Also ensure that your ground from the battery is good - I always do another ground from the battery straight to chassis with a 4ga piece of cable just to prevent any possible earthing issues.

[bamakin]

Ground it on the metal chassis, either under a screw or somewhere else suitable. Then run it down to a point on the chassis, sand it down to bare metal, bolt it in, and just lightly paint over the top (to prevent corrosion).

Also ensure that your ground from the battery is good - I always do another ground from the battery straight to chassis with a 4ga piece of cable just to prevent any possible earthing issues.

Thanks for the reply mate. This is my next job on the list.
I have also been looking at 6.5 inch speakers from the loudest.co.uk, they look decent enough to use as fronts. they say you can split the speaker to use them as components and have them together.
Have you bought any gear from these?

[wintertidenz]

I'm in NZ sorry! You would be best off buying a separate component set IMO. Sometimes they make compromises with the cone when they build the convertible sets.

[VR457]

Just compare prices and reviews on other sites. If the brand is ok and you're paying around £35 plus then it will probably be ok.

[bamakin]

Just an update for this thread....Firstly thanks for all the replies.
I first of all bought better quality wiring for the power and ground. I tested the new ground cable running directly from the battery but it made no difference so just used a bolt under my seat (as moved install from boot to under front seat also to see if this made any difference). Also moving the rca cables and power cable either on separate sides of the car or next to each other made no difference either.
However when i changed the power cable out it reduced the interference noise substantially. Once the amp gain was setup it is barely audible and cant be heard once volume goes past 1/2. Result!!! (of sorts!)
The only time I can hear it now is if I crank the gain up on the amp way beyond what i need. The other thing was the switches on the amp have broke for the hpf/lpf/off. i have to use a screwdriver to switch these over by poking it in the gap where the switch used to be. when switching modes i get interference too so hopefully when i replace this amp i wont get any interference.
I now have two infinity reference 9366i's 6 by 9's on custom parcel shelf in speaker boxes and 12" sub underneath so getting decent sound out now aswell as alpine headunit picked up off ebay 4 by 60 watts with three (4v) outputs.
nothing special here but sounds good. next month will be components and then trying to thread new wires through those damn rubber fittings for the rear door cables!! tried the other day but gave up!!

Thanks again everyone!

[VR457]

Well done! Sounds like your amplifier connection where the power lead goes in might be at fault. Try another amp if you get the chance.

[bamakin]

Well done! Sounds like your amplifier connection where the power lead goes in might be at fault. Try another amp if you get the chance.

Yeah im going to get shot of my existing one its lasted about 5/6 years so done well. i want a compact 4 channel amp that packs a bit of a punch. the search is on!!
any recommendations would be welcome. budget upto 150, watts 600 to 1000, 4 channel, as compact as possible.

laterz!!

[VR457]

JL Audio 300/4. Regulated power supply, means whatever the battery voltage it will still dish it out.

Will look up others depending on your price range!

[bamakin]

JL Audio 300/4. Regulated power supply, means whatever the battery voltage it will still dish it out.

Will look up others depending on your price range!

That amp looks awesome but bit out of what i can spend really. can push to 200 quid. thanks for looking though mate!!
ps i wont be telling my wife im buying a new amp lol!! secret purchase!!! i use the divide by 4 rule. if its 200 quid i will tell her it was 50! lol!

[VR457]

What about Vibe Blackbox Stereo 4 from http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/vibe-blackbox-stereo-4.html ?

A massive 4 x 100WRMS at 4 ohms. Proper, solid watts here.

Come to think of it, i might just get one for myself!

[bamakin]

What about Vibe Blackbox Stereo 4 from http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/vibe-blackbox-stereo-4.html ?

A massive 4 x 100WRMS at 4 ohms. Proper, solid watts here.

Come to think of it, i might just get one for myself!

I LIKE IT!!!!! think i will buy one!!
have you watched the video below the pic of the amp its a youtube video with "tiffany" she's got a right pair!!
oh yes.

[VR457]

Too busy buying the amp mate! I got a 'refurbed' one from ebay - http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VIBE-BLACKBOX-STEREO-4-AMPLIFIER-4-x-100W-RMS-4-OHM-/250744050819?pt=UK_Audio_TV_Electronics_In_Car_Ent ertainment_GPS_Car_Amplifiers_PP&hash=item3a61829483

Looks like they deal officially with repairing these things plus they have good rep.

Will let you know how its doing in about a week when i have received and installed it.

Ps - at that price you dont even have to lie to the missus.....

[bamakin]

the video is of some fit bird unboxing the amp. will check out the ebay link.............

[bamakin]

I just bought the other one!!
thanks for the link!

[VR457]

I think you're mesmerised by her bazookas....

Since you've ordered now both of us can find out if we got supplied duffs or good stuff.

Not that duff.....the amp!

[bamakin]

I think you're mesmerised by her bazookas....

Since you've ordered now both of us can find out if we got supplied duffs or good stuff.

Not that duff.....the amp!

lol!! I reckon we should be ok. You will be able to test yours first as I am still working offshore until next wednesday so got to wait a whole week before i can play with my new toy!!
have you put your own wires in the back doors on your leggie? through the rubbers? i had a go but it was solid. i have the mdf speaker mounts ready made with speakers ready to go in but could not thread wire through. did not have the patience that day lol so gave up!!

[VR457]

It was a pain but got it done! Need a lot of patience on that one.

[Pugme]

if your looking for a good sounding setup you shouldnt really have rear speakers, they will throw the sound stage right off! btw

[bamakin]

if your looking for a good sounding setup you shouldnt really have rear speakers, they will throw the sound stage right off! btw

How would you recommend the setup?
I was going to go for two 6 by 9's on rear shelf with 12" sub in boot which already got, , with four door speakers (fronts components, rear two ways) , using a 4 channel amp and a mono amp for the sub?
saying that i am no expert in this stuff!!

[wintertidenz]

I would get rid of the 6x9's - they will muddy the bass and sound up.

You can have rear speakers, but fade them out a bit and use them basically as backfill - this is what I have done in all my installs, and it works well - shuts the back seat drivers up anyway ;)

The two amp setup sounds just fine with the components and the mono for the sub.
Just remember to tune the gains on the amps right - ideally you do it with a scope, but the other way is to turn volume up to about 3/4 and then tweak the gains until you hear distortion, then back it off a bit.

[Pugme]

as above, but if u was gonna spend for example, 150 on 6x9, 150 on rear speakers and 200-250 on front comps, you get a much better sound just spending 550-600 on front comps, and amp/set them up properly with your 12 in the boot.

[VR457]

I'm reflecting some of the advice already given; basically, its ok to have a two or four speaker setup and a sub. You can choose either rear door speakers or 6 x 9. It is true, the 6 x 9 will mess up the bass from the sub. However, if you know what you are doing and can set crossover frequencies then you can use them. So, the 12" sub will play signals from 80Hz downwards and the 6 x 9 play signals from 120hz upwards. The gap in the middle will normally be covered by the transfer function inherent in most cars. With 6 x 9 you can get very good mid range punch / kick drums and it will add greatly to the sound for artists like U2.

Like i said, it's all in the setup. You get people saying that sound should only come from the front like you are attending a concert but that is a preference with others going for a sound that surrounds your ears, even sounding heavier from the back. I once used time alignment to make the sub bass sound like it was coming from the front and it was ace. But nine times out of ten its impossible to get the sound right in a car without spending a squillion hours on setup.

[VR457]

have you put your own wires in the back doors on your leggie? through the rubbers? i had a go but it was solid. i have the mdf speaker mounts ready made with speakers ready to go in but could not thread wire through. did not have the patience that day lol so gave up!!

I notice from an old writeup that i used a screwdriver to push the wire through the rubber and then grabbed the other end with pliers and pulled it.

[bamakin]

I think you're mesmerised by her bazookas....

Since you've ordered now both of us can find out if we got supplied duffs or good stuff.

Not that duff.....the amp!

My amp got delivered today. Cant wait to get home and get this baby runnin!!
Have you looked at yours yet?
Its not just an empty shell is it?? lol!!
Do you know what voltage output you would get from this amp to work out how many speakers you can connect to balance out the ohms??

[VR457]

I was out so didnt get it. Will chase up tomorrow.

The spec sheet for the amp says 4 x 100wrms at 4 ohms or 4 x 125wrms at 2 ohms or 2 x 250wrms bridged 4 ohms.

In theory you can parallel wire 4 speakers to two channels, this showing the amp a 2 ohm load and bridge the other two channels for the subwoofer, getting 250wrms for the sub but i don't know if the amp would handle it. You would probably have to email the company with this configuration.

[VR457]

Got the amp and installed it! The sound is tonally very accurate; i hardly needed to tweak the equalizer when setting it. The bass is very neutral, not overblown but has good presence. Power wise, it goes very loud with no muffling or straining of the sound.

Use the HPF filter and turn the dial all the way down to 50Hz. I have gain set to 9 o clock at the moment; will set it on multimeter when i have time.

Only one problem - the amp is quite long! I'm going to have to carve up my mdf to fit it properly.

All in all, a damn good purchase. Its got rid of the whining noise i had and sounds brilliant. It would give the JL 300/4 a good run in the sound quality stakes.

[bamakin]

Got the amp and installed it! The sound is tonally very accurate; i hardly needed to tweak the equalizer when setting it. The bass is very neutral, not overblown but has good presence. Power wise, it goes very loud with no muffling or straining of the sound.

Use the HPF filter and turn the dial all the way down to 50Hz. I have gain set to 9 o clock at the moment; will set it on multimeter when i have time.

Only one problem - the amp is quite long! I'm going to have to carve up my mdf to fit it properly.

All in all, a damn good purchase. Its got rid of the whining noise i had and sounds brilliant. It would give the JL 300/4 a good run in the sound quality stakes.

Sounds great! Cant wait to get home and get mine wired in! I will take your advice on the hpf filter.
Thanks for letting me know what its like and for your advice!
I have been looking at components on Ebay and you can get some good ones quite cheap.

[VR457]

Are you going to use the one amp for your speakers and subs or two? If you use one amp (the Vibe i mean, using the other two channels for the sub) then make sure all four door speakers are the same.

PS - Do NOT buy second hand speakers! You could have failing speaker suspension, overstressed voice coils, blown tweeters, dodgy crossovers and so on. The foam surrounds on speakers decay over time due to damp from door installations as well.

Buy a good set from names like CDT, Focal, DLS or higher end range from Alpine and Pioneer but not their cheap ones.

[bamakin]

Are you going to use the one amp for your speakers and subs or two? If you use one amp (the Vibe i mean, using the other two channels for the sub) then make sure all four door speakers are the same.

PS - Do NOT buy second hand speakers! You could have failing speaker suspension, overstressed voice coils, blown tweeters, dodgy crossovers and so on. The foam surrounds on speakers decay over time due to damp from door installations as well.

Buy a good set from names like CDT, Focal, DLS or higher end range from Alpine and Pioneer but not their cheap ones.

My old amp which i am currently using will alone power the sub until i buy a smaller more compact mono sub. The new amp will power all my internal speakers. I know people dont like it, but, i have built myself a parcel shelf with 6 by 9's mounted in speaker boxes facing to front of car. I will attempt to use crossover on these to take the bass out and set them up to run nice with sub. I have managed it before, using sub set low and as you suggested before i will will have 6 by 9's running higher above 150. Once I have my components which I will order in next couple of days I should be well on my way to getting a sound that I like even on a smaller budget.

[VR457]

Sounds like a plan. It all depends on setup and how well you can integrate the sound. Get going with the install!

[VR457]

Something to encourage you to get started....


40624

[bamakin]

I like it!
Are you running subs?
Whats your speaker setup?

[VR457]

Fronts are Rockford Fosgate FNQ series which are quite old now. Rears are some average Alpine jobbie.

As regarding bass, i have had the equipment sitting around for two years doing nothing, waiting to sound deaden the car, fit a rear strut brace and so on. I'm fed up with it now and just going to install it anyway when i get time, perhaps within the month.