GROUP BUY: 264 degree cam regrinds

[Adam.Findlay]

As detailed in this thread
http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?60575-EOI-Aftermarket-cam-grinds-and-Valve-spring-group-buy&highlight=eoi+cam+regrind

I will be organising a group buy of cam regrinds via kennely cams @ $630 NZD for all 4 camshafts EDIT you must supply stock cams to be reground, although if i can source extra ones locally I may do it on exchange basis

http://www.kcams.co.nz/Menu/Home.php

Peter kennard, the man who runs the above mentioned business is the man who used to design cam profiles for kelford camtech, now he runs his own business here in christchurch

the numbers told to myself by peter were taking the stock cams to 264 degres of duration @ 0.1mm lift. and bringing the overall lift of the cams to 10.5mm this is a huge step up on stock cams and even out performs the RPW billet cams (272 advertised duration @ 0 lift and 8.5mm overll lift) these RPW cams retail for $2300+ NZD almost 4 times the cost
http://www.rpw.com.au/shop/index.php?page=shop.product_details&product_id=2411&flypage=flypage.tpl&pop=0&keyword=camshafts&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

some people may worry about removing the hardened surface from the working surface from the cam lobe., this is not an issue as there is no material being ground off the tip of the lobe which is the part of the cam which does all the work. ie the part that needs to be hard.
the only issue with this is because the cams have so much lift they require the valve springs to be changed to ones which wont bind. but again as mentioned in the thread linked above evo 4G63T valve springs fit which peter can supply at $345NZD for a set of 24 springs
the valve springs can be easily changed folowing the guide below
http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-how-requests-questions-tips/239619-how-car-valve-spring-retainer-install.html
the valve springs can easily be changed without taking the engine out of the car or even taking the head off the engine, saving hundreds and hundreds of dollars on head gaskets and lots of time

so far the list of intrested persons is a follows
New Zealand
-Myself (cams + springs)
-Carl (cams + springs)
-Kenneth (cams + springs)
-Scott.mohekey (cams+springs)

Australia
-Trent (cams+springs)


the more people intrested could possibly bring down the cost of the regrind and possibly the cost of valve springs also. please register your intrest I look to complete this by early febuary

[foxdie]

Hi Adam, 2 things;

1. Would Peter consider doing a joint purchase deal of the cam regrinds + springs (as you've said, you need uprated springs to use the cam regrinds) for something like $900 NZD?
2. How much for P&P to the UK?

Thanks in advance :)

[Kenneth]

What is the time frame for this?

Just about to move house, so not a good time until late this month. Otherwise I am in :)

Ken

As detailed in this thread
http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?60575-EOI-Aftermarket-cam-grinds-and-Valve-spring-group-buy&highlight=eoi+cam+regrind

I will be organising a group buy of cam regrinds via kennely cams @ $630 NZD for all 4 camshafts

http://www.kcams.co.nz/Menu/Home.php

Peter kennard, the man who runs the above mentioned business is the man who used to design cam profiles for kelford camtech, now he runs his own business here in christchurch

the numbers told to myself by peter were taking the stock cams to 264 degres of duration @ 0.1mm lift. and bringing the overall lift of the cams to 10.5mm this is a huge step up on stock cams and even out performs the RPW billet cams (272 advertised duration @ 0 lift and 8.5mm overll lift) these RPW cams retail for $2300+ NZD almost 4 times the cost
http://www.rpw.com.au/shop/index.php?page=shop.product_details&product_id=2411&flypage=flypage.tpl&pop=0&keyword=camshafts&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1

some people may worry about removing the hardened surface from the working surface from the cam lobe., this is not an issue as there is no material being ground off the tip of the lobe which is the part of the cam which does all the work. ie the part that needs to be hard.
the only issue with this is because the cams have so much lift they require the valve springs to be changed to ones which wont bind. but again as mentioned in the thread linked above evo 4G63T valve springs fit which peter can supply at $345NZD for a set of 24 springs
the valve springs can be easily changed folowing the guide below
http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-how-requests-questions-tips/239619-how-car-valve-spring-retainer-install.html
the valve springs can easily be changed without taking the engine out of the car or even taking the head off the engine, saving hundreds and hundreds of dollars on head gaskets and lots of time

so far the list of intrested persons is a follows
-Myself
-Carl aka patryn999
-Kenneth (maby)


the more people intrested could possibly bring down the cost of the regrind and possibly the cost of valve springs also. please register your intrest I look to complete this by early febuary

[Gly]

so i take it that is the cost when you supply your own cams?

or is that cams supplied?...


also http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?61522

if anyone wants to buy a spare set to get worked.

(can take paypal if any oversea's buyer wants them)

[Adam.Findlay]

Hi Adam, 2 things;

1. Would Peter consider doing a joint purchase deal of the cam regrinds + springs (as you've said, you need uprated springs to use the cam regrinds) for something like $900 NZD?
2. How much for P&P to the UK?

Thanks in advance :)

1.-I shall go down to see him now and enquire about what sort of deal he can do for at least 3 sets being done + springs. plus as Gly mentioned below the regrind is done on a "I bring him x stock cams and he gives me them back after he regrinds them" so you would either have to source some cams in nz for me to bring him (buy Gly's ones) or post me some of your own
2.- never posted to the uk before maby someone else could give an estimate on this??


What is the time frame for this?

Just about to move house, so not a good time until late this month. Otherwise I am in :)

Ken

As stated at the very end of my first post end of jan / start of feb. So Ill count you in for cams + springs?


so i take it that is the cost when you supply your own cams?

or is that cams supplied?...


also http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?61522

if anyone wants to buy a spare set to get worked.

(can take paypal if any oversea's buyer wants them)

You must send in a set of cams (sorry bit of a big oversight there)

[Kenneth]

Yep, I'm in for cams and springs.

[Adam.Findlay]

Kenneth if you are intrested Carl and myself will be purchasing one of the valve spring compressors required

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-OHV-OHC-Overhead-Valve-Spring-Compressor-Tool-/170749974380?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&vxp=mtr&hash=item27c17dd76c

could send it up to you to install the springs with. save you having to take the heads off

[Adam.Findlay]

also for any UK members intrested i just found NJ's thread
http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?61572-Full-set-of-VR4-cams

[Kenneth]

That would be great, thanks :)

Kenneth if you are intrested Carl and myself will be purchasing one of the valve spring compressors required

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-OHV-OHC-Overhead-Valve-Spring-Compressor-Tool-/170749974380?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&vxp=mtr&hash=item27c17dd76c

could send it up to you to install the springs with. save you having to take the heads off

[wintertidenz]

PM bradc - he may be interested as well.

[Wodjno]

/juggle :anxious::furious4: :thinking2

[Adam.Findlay]

PM bradc - he may be interested as well.
done


/juggle :anxious::furious4: :thinking2
not sure what you mean by that but come on. do it....

[scott.mohekey]

What effect can we expect these to have?

[Adam.Findlay]

In basics, shift peak toque and horsepower over to the right about 1000rpm. as well as increasing flow in higher RPM possibly allowing our tiny turbos to hold 15psi of boost all the way to the 7200RPM redline. as well as peak torque curve extended past the stock 4500rpm allowing peak horsepower to be pushed toward the stock redline. more torque higher in the rev range = more horsepower.
the few people here on club who have used cams are
-zentac (600+ hp 6a13tt)
-Shane aka Fully (cams on a stock engine stock turbos with only a 600x300x76 FMIC)

shane mentioned to me once that his reground cams "woke the car up alot with a boost increase to 1 bar" and I belive he did that with stock cam gears and stock tune.
combine the cams I am offering with some adjustable cam gears
http://www.lelong.com.my/works-t7-cam-pulley-gear-perdana-v6-6a10-6a12-6a13-4-pcs-K898041-2007-01-Sale-I.htm
aswell as a 7203 or 7202 reflash ecu tune and some good gains are to be had,

PS: could possibly be organising a Group Buy on the cam gears linked above once SAF68 verifies the quality of the works engineering products as stated in this thread
http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?61415-Cams-gear

[Adam.Findlay]

also when I take the cams in I will get peter to do a screenshot of the stock cams lift and duration (from his little machine) and then a screen shot of the reground ones, you all know what the centerlines and overlap are so if you do wish to offset the timing by a tooth on the timing belt or with adjustable cam gears you know which way you will need to adjust it for what you are trying to acheive

[lathiat]

I'm keen.. but I'm guessing I'll need to get my camshafts over to you?

Fortunately I have a spare engine so I'm thinking I can take them out of that for the swapover.

Or are camshafts dime a dozen in NZ?

[Adam.Findlay]

I'm keen.. but I'm guessing I'll need to get my camshafts over to you?

Fortunately I have a spare engine so I'm thinking I can take them out of that for the swapover.

Or are camshafts dime a dozen in NZ?

Dime a dozen i wish. probably about the same as in OZ

yes you will need to supply me with stock cams as I only have one spare set to regrind and that is so I dont have to take my legnum off the road for more then the weekend taken to fit the cams. you might get lucky having a browse on trademe and find some here in nz and save yourself having to pay shipping both ways.

[swinks]

Oh... welll...it's always wrong time.
Haven't got spare 500 quid (excluding spring set and 2x shipping) to pursuit this project. Very tempting tho, but need this cash for different purpose. If it was offered later this year (September onwards), then I'm in, but now it's being jealous left for me.

[Adam.Findlay]

Oh... welll...it's always wrong time.
Haven't got spare 500 quid (excluding spring set and 2x shipping) to pursuit this project. Very tempting tho, but need this cash for different purpose. If it was offered later this year (September onwards), then I'm in, but now it's being jealous left for me.

the price stated above is what he quoted me for one regrind and one set of springs, the purpose of this thread is to gather numbers of intrested persons so I can take that number to him and try get the unit price down for each person via a group buy as I will be bringing him potentially thousands of dollars worth of work with minimal retooling effort on his part.
I can do this later in the year as a one unit order if you so wish but there will be slim to none chance for discount. Or if i find some cheap spare cams here in nz I may add them to the list and then sell them on at a later date..

[swinks]

Adam, that seems alright, and sure later this year I'll be up for those cams. I need to finish one project first before jump into another, and I need to be very careful with optimistic over stretching budget. Anyway thanks for giving some hope... :)

[Adam.Findlay]

Adam, that seems alright, and sure later this year I'll be up for those cams. I need to finish one project first before jump into another, and I need to be very careful with optimistic over stretching budget. Anyway thanks for giving some hope... :)
No worries. I will post up if i can get a hold of some extra stock cams that i can get worked and hold for you.

[Eurospec]

Valve springs and retainers can be a bit 'fun' with heads still on, but i do have a tool to make this easier for you if anyone wants to borrow.

You will want a leakdown tester or other means of pressuring the cylinder with compressed air, and then the walloper (for want of a better word) to compress the springs and remove the collets in one easy ish pop.

Cheers,

Ben.

[Adam.Findlay]

Valve springs and retainers can be a bit 'fun' with heads still on, but i do have a tool to make this easier for you if anyone wants to borrow.

You will want a leakdown tester or other means of pressuring the cylinder with compressed air, and then the walloper (for want of a better word) to compress the springs and remove the collets in one easy ish pop.

Cheers,

Ben.

yip i did my best to find a easy way of doing the valve springs, the guide I linked In my origional post makes use of a relativly cheap tool plus the use of a air compressor, and in the thread it also says if you cannot get hold of an air compressor you can put the cylinder you are working on at halfway down. lower a length of rope through the spark plug hole and then rotate the crank toward TDC so the rope compresses against the valves, this way the valves will stay closed when using the spring compressor and they will not contact the piston (avoiding any metal to metal contact)

[Adam.Findlay]

bump for the 5th person comitted are there any other intrested persons

[Patryn999]

Might be worth asking him how long it'll take him, if cams are a scarcity we do have a spare set each in our engines - so if he's doing it over a few days (weekend inbetween maybe) and interest is enough we could potentially install the freshly ground set and give him the stocks to do?

If it increases interest :P

[taupodrifta]

I have a spare set of cams if anyone wants to buy them

[Adam.Findlay]

i will be going to talk it over with him this coming thursday so will ask about the turnaround time

and thankyou Alistair another set of cams in NZ for sale, What are you after for them?

[taupodrifta]

No idea what they worth really so make an offer really

[Adam.Findlay]

Bump for any extra intrest before I go in tomorrow to try renegotiate prices

[Mark 4]

:curtain:http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?61597-VR4-Parts-for-sale/page2 :curtain::embarasse

[lathiat]

Any luck on the negotiation?

[Patryn999]

When I talked to him last night he'd gotten about $100 off the cam grind, and was looking to see if he could negotiate a lower cost for the springs additionally. But you'd have to get him (Adam) to confirm this.

[Fully]

I have a spare set of cams, and in chch as well =)

[Adam.Findlay]

he said he "should" be able to knock around $100 off per set of reground cams ie bringing it from $630 to $530.
he also talked about possibly doing 10% off the valve springs bringing them down to the ~310 mark

Today i dropped off all 3 of the christchurch sets of cams I had he is already at work desgining the profile and testing it in one of my spare heads.
@ kenneth and Trent as soon as your cams arrive here in chch (providing peter has all the profile designs finished) he said it should be a 3 day turn around to get all 5 sets ground.

So for anyone else intrested you better be quick!

Also PM me if you cannot afford to join this buy now and I may be able to sort you out a layby kind of thing deposit and i will grind some cams for you and you pay the full ammount + purchace springs at a later date

[lathiat]

he said he "should" be able to knock around $100 off per set of reground cams ie bringing it from $630 to $530.
he also talked about possibly doing 10% off the valve springs bringing them down to the ~310 mark

Today i dropped off all 3 of the christchurch sets of cams I had he is already at work desgining the profile and testing it in one of my spare heads.
@ kenneth and Trent as soon as your cams arrive here in chch (providing peter has all the profile designs finished) he said it should be a 3 day turn around to get all 5 sets ground.

So for anyone else intrested you better be quick!

Also PM me if you cannot afford to join this buy now and I may be able to sort you out a layby kind of thing deposit and i will grind some cams for you and you pay the full ammount + purchace springs at a later date

i asked gly to send my cams today... I can send full payment this monday.


would be keen to see photos & diagram showing the changes made after the test run is finished.

[Gly]

will you be doing another buy later down the track?

id like to see results before committing to buying

[Adam.Findlay]

i asked gly to send my cams today... I can send full payment this monday.


would be keen to see photos & diagram showing the changes made after the test run is finished.
will be checking up on progress and posting as much before and after

I will be road tuning my car but for either trent or kenneth if you do manage to get before and after dyno plots that would be great

@GLY
If there is significant intrest in doing another one later in the year ie 3 persons or more i will run another buy if not I am more then happy to put my face to your cams if you decide to do a set independantly (so peter kennard knows its repeat business to try get better pricing)

[Adam.Findlay]

Update today peter has reduced the lift from 10.5 to 9.8mm to make the cam more stable for the stock lifters and rockers still a huge increase on stock and the duration will remain at 264

[lathiat]

What is the standard lift and duration, can't find that in the other threads.

And I'm guessing this lift still needs new valve springs?

[thfelipeth]

will be checking up on progress and posting as much before and after

I will be road tuning my car but for either trent or kenneth if you do manage to get before and after dyno plots that would be great

@GLY
If there is significant intrest in doing another one later in the year ie 3 persons or more i will run another buy if not I am more then happy to put my face to your cams if you decide to do a set independantly (so peter kennard knows its repeat business to try get better pricing)

i would be very interested for a group buy later on this year

[Adam.Findlay]

What is the standard lift and duration, can't find that in the other threads.

And I'm guessing this lift still needs new valve springs?
I dont know that yet will have to go and get a print out of the stock cams profile next time I am there and yes 9.8mm lift still requires a change in spring. Peter said that the stock springs are very low in pressure and even just changing the springs may result in a power gain at high rpms


i would be very interested for a group buy later on this year

noted mate

[Adie]

I would also be interested later on in the year.

[Adam.Findlay]

new thread started here

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?61706-Group-Buy-Cam-regrings-ROUND-2-discussion&p=680981#post680981

for those intrested in a group buy later in the year

[Gly]

a few questions about the springs to be supplied,

are they just stock evo springs? uprated evo springs? something else?

would standard evo springs suit the reground cams?

[Adam.Findlay]

uprated evo springs. I can get the specs for you if you so wish.
stock evo springs might do the trick but could be pushing the boundrys as they are very similar to vr4 springs but with a stronger spring constant

[Adam.Findlay]

In for the first group is officially closed. once one of the members or myself has installed the cams will post results and possibly someone may go for a dyno run to prove the cams worth to the 2nd group

[lathiat]

Can you please also ask Peter to clarify his thoughts regarding issues to do with rocker clearance:


Several sources (in person and online) are telling me that because the base circle size is reduced, clearances to the hydraulic lifters is increased which can either lead to noise, or the requirement to shim them in order to keep things in check.

Thus I'd like to know how much additional clearance is created and if/what he believes should be done about that and why.

Thanks.

[Adam.Findlay]

will do trent. next time I go and see him which will either be wednesday or thursday depending on when your cams arrive at my flat

[Adam.Findlay]

trent.
peter told me today the regrinds have been desgined to work without shims but if you are worried about it you can remove the circlip off the top of your lifters (circlip is only there to hold the lifters together when they are not in the engine) removing this clip will allow the lifter to pump up an extra mm or so.

[Adam.Findlay]

Update for those people who are intrested. the first set of reground cams went into carl's (aka patron999) galant today the performance increase is quite large, very very small sacrifice of low down torque for a masive gain in 4krpm+ power. it seems to help the turbos flow a little bit more up top also. carls galant felt like it pulled much harder @ 10psi then my legnum does on 15psi of boost. hopefully carl himself can post up soon with his opinion after a bit more driving time.
Will ask carl to update again after he has flashed KSmods extended maps on and tuned the fueling and ignition maps. hopefully there is more to be pulled from it again

also carls galant remained lifter tick free with the reground cams installed :)
also found out the valve springs supplied are Brian crower brand
Spring Pressure: BC1100 Seat: 1.550" @ 84 lbs / Open: 1.000" @ 235 lbs / Coil Bind: 0.935" (no machine work required)

[scott.mohekey]

Excellent smithers.. excellent ..

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

[Davezj]

asked question in wrong place