Prop to transmission help

[johnmcarter]

Some may re-call that I was looking for a cat a few weeks back. This was because I was led to believe that mine had split asunder!! The real problem was that a load of wadding had somehow wrapped itself around the front end of the prop shaft and around the end of the transmission box. I did manage to clear all the wadding away and thought everything was A1 - should have known better!! After not many more miles on the clock a metallic rubbing sound has appeared, so, under the car we go to see what's happening.

There appears to be a metal 'cup' from which comes the drive for the prop shaft. Inside this metal cup is a metal sleeve which appears to have worked its way loose and is rattling away on the shaft. Can someone tell me what's gone wrong? How does that metal sleeve hold in place - is it in fact the outersleeve of a bearing? I guess also that the other side of that metal sleeve is a seal of some sort? I (hopefully!) show photos below to explain what I'm talking about and would appreciate any hints/tips/advice on how to rectify the prob.

Many thanks

http://i921.photobucket.com/albums/ad52/roxy1146/Legnum/CIMG0511.jpg

http://i921.photobucket.com/albums/ad52/roxy1146/Legnum/CIMG0509.jpg

http://i921.photobucket.com/albums/ad52/roxy1146/Legnum/CIMG0512.jpg

[Wodjno]

From what i can see on the dodgy pictures :D It seems the shaft is not fully located into the box. The ridge on the shaft ? Is that metal or remainder of the wadding ?

[johnmcarter]

Thanks for the reply.

Apologies for the 'dodgy' pictures - not easy trying to manouver camera into a decent position when car is only a foot off the ground.

Not sure how the shaft cannot be properly located in the box unless the prop is telescopic - I would think that once in there the prop to some extent holds it in place, doesn't it? No?

When the wadding was wrapped around the shaft I think the abrasion polished up parts opf the shaft - how much, if any metal actually went walk-about I don't know but I think the 'ridge' you refer to is largely a discolouration due to the rubbing itself not a ridge as such.

Any further thoughts?

Many thanks,

[Nick Mann]

The cup on the end of the transfer box is just a dust cover, it is a friction fit on the box. The propshaft goes in to the transfer box on a set of splines, so as the engine rocks the splines can slide slightly to prevent excessive strain on the prop.

Apart from some funny colours I can't see any issues on your photos, but then my memory isn't brilliant and I don't have a known good photo to compare it to.

If you had wadding around that part of the prop/transfer box then my biggest worry would be that the shaft seal for the prop was damaged, which would allow your transfer box oil to leak out. It doesn't look wet, so I'd guess you are alright, but maybe a tranfer box oil change isn't a bad plan and doesn't cost the earth.

[Nick Mann]

Also, thinking about it, the shaft oil seal is in between the bearing and the outside world, so if that bit rattling is anything to do with the bearing then there is definitely no oil in there!

[johnmcarter]

Thanks Nick, but what sits inside the cup? I've definately got a metal sleeve/ring which is loose inside the cup cos when I first looked it was flapping around outside the cup on the shaft. I've simply pushed it back in and now can't get it to come out again although it is very loose. I'll try to find some piccies of it in the resources but in the meantime if anyone knows and can put my mind at ease I'd be grateful!!

[johnmcarter]

And, no, there are no oil leaks in the area. If I undo the uj can I just pull out that end shaft then - will oil leak then from the box? I'm just thinking if I remove that end shaft and then remove the cup I can see exactly what's what by taking them to the workbench. Thanks

[Nick Mann]

Yes, removing the prop from the transfer box will release oil.

I don't remember anything else being loose in that area. Next time I am under one I will see what is there.

[Nutter_John]

got loads of props and xfer boxs so will take a photo tomorrow for ya of what they should look like

[johnmcarter]

Cheers John - that would be great. If you could have a gander inside the 'cup' as well that would be even better. What's in there - must be something or mine is mine unique!!

[johnmcarter]

Bump! Any further help or advice greatly appreciated. I've had another look under the car and the metal sleeve that is rattling around is about 3cm wide, 3-5 mm thick and about 5cm outside diameter. Does that help? Is there a bearing which sits inside the cup and could this sleeve be the outer shell of it? I can't see past the sleeve into the cup to give any further detail anddon't want to strip it down until I know any spare bits needed are obtainable. Thanks in anticipation of further comment!!

[Davezj]

Hi there,
when you say cup, there is a outer cup is on the transfer case and the inner cup on the propshaft i believe, they are present to protect from dirt and debris getting onto the part of the propshaft that slides in and out of the transfer case.
it looks like the inner cup on the propshaft has broken off (probably due to the wadding) and is allwed to stop rotating with the propshaft. the mark on the propshaft looks like a weld point where the inner cup was attached.
i will check ASA for a pic of the transfer case end of the propshaft to see if what i have said is correct.

Edit:-
i have checked ASA and there should be an inner cup attached to the propshaft.
So it looks like yours has broken off the propshaft.

[crazydriver81]

To emphasize the words of Dave, the cup on the propshaft is missing (see the red circle in the picture below).

Just for reference, I attach a picture "how should the tf-case look like" and some detail pics of TF-case and propshaft from ASA.

505865058750588

[Nick Mann]

Perfect pictures, Stefan!

John, in the short term I'd drain the transfer box oil, remove the prop and then lose the ring. I'd refit without anything else and refill the transfer box oil. That stops the ring doing further damage. Then I'd investigate a spare propshaft or look into getting hold of a replacement dust cup.

[johnmcarter]

Sorry for not replying sooner but I've been away with no internet access!! Many thanks to you all. Prop shaft being removed today so that the sleeve can be taken off. Local Mitsi dealer can get the cup (with a bit of waiting time!) for just under £30 so I'll order that and can then compare with Stefan's piccies. Yes, excellent piccies thanks Stefan. Can't quite see whether the inner and outer cup should be one complete unit or not but one step at a time and we'll soon learn!! Thanks to all again for helping me out

[Davezj]

The inner cup just sits inside the outer cup and does not touch.

But if the inner cup has just separated from the propshaft and it is still round then I don't see why you can't just weld it back on.
The only issue I can see in doing this is if the cup is not perfectly centralised then you might get a slight imbalance in the prop shaft and maybe due that a vibration. But the slight imbalance will be right at the end of the prop shaft and that is fixed by the tea Sefer box. So probably will not make much difference.