Wheel alignment results - opinions please

[VR457]

Paid £40 for a check and adjustment at an ATS garage. The only adjustment required was toe in, with left side -0.26 and right side 0.21.

After adjustment front toe in is 0.01-0.03. The front camber is Left, -0.5 / Right, -0.57

The rear toe in is Left, 0.03 / Right, -0.11. The rear camber is Left, -2.26 / Right, -2.11

I'm sure the rear camber is out?

Following on from this thread: http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?62382-4-wheel-alignment-recommendations-please

[Atik]

Which ATS did you go to Jamil? I suspect I will be needing an alignment soon as I'm changing some parts on the front soon.

[Subaru ETA]

I assume the car is lowered?

[elnevio]

Camber looks too much. This will happen if your car is lowered without other modification. It can't be adjusted as such, although it can be modified - there's a thread on here about it somewhere! Possibly by Gly?

[VR457]

Thanks Wodj for linking the posts up.

Atik, it was Aldridge but im sure there is a large one in Aston. The store locator shows if the branches do wheel alignment.

The car is not lowered at all. It's standard springs, uprated dampers (KYB Ultra SR) which were same length as stock, poly bush engine / gearbox mount. When driving at speed the back does feel more keen to let go though that could be because of the rear strut brace.

[adaxo]

Maybe boot full of massive speakers and amps causing car to sit that bit lower :inquisiti:drummer:??

[VR457]

Rear Camber adjustment article found! - http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?19221-Do-It-Yourself-Rear-Wheel-Camber-Adjustment&highlight=camber

Adam, you may be right! Around 70kg plus tools and thick jump leads on 14 year old springs is not helping.

[adaxo]

Deffo that is the reason, I remember when mine rear camber was out and it change a lot after emptying my boot on site

[VR457]

Thanks for the info. Taking it all out now......

......or get help to put washer and bolt in.....

Can i not get standard height springs but with more stiffness?

[adaxo]

Washer and bolt looks pretty simple but IMO isn't, I'm struggle to find longer bolts witch correct thread pitch and strength, washers could be used from here (http://www.screwfix.com/p/penny-washers-a2-stainless-steel-m6-x-25-pack-of-10/99795?cm_sp=Search-_-SearchRec-_-Area2&_requestid=250445)
At first time I fit 4 washers on each bolt and nearly crash on M60, rear end start behave really badly, like on ice above 60 mph, so go back to garage and fit two washers on each side and now camber is still well out but not like b4.

[VR457]

So without the washers what problem did you have? Was it understeer? My back end already feels sensitive (!), with washers is this going to get worse?

[adaxo]

Car (without any washers) feels ok its just the matter of incredible quick wear at inner of rear tires due to huge negative camber after lowering, and change for wider and with less offset wheels didn't help either.

[VR457]

So the tradeoff for reducing tyre wear is oversteer / unstable handling.

Is it possible that changing the bushes will help?

Also, i found a nice page with lots of handling info - http://www.trackpedia.com/wiki/Vehicle_Dynamics_-_Cause_and_Effect_Guide

[Subaru ETA]

Putting a heap of toe in on the rear will counter act the wear caused by the camber and you won't notice any difference in handling

[VR457]

More specific info on the camber mod here: http://ozvr4.com/forums/showthread.php?859-How-To-Adjust-Your-Rear-Wheel-Camber/page2&highlight=camber

Is the only reason for getting rid of negative camber is tyre wear? I thought handling improvement would be the result of doing this...

[adaxo]

Putting a heap of toe in on the rear will counter act the wear caused by the camber and you won't notice any difference in handling

Have you got any figures in mind?? I go to redone my front wheels soon, so could sneak some new settings on the back. Car is lowered by 40mm

[Subaru ETA]

I put as much as possible on it when I did mine. I had it on the alignment machine, put as much toe in as poss and then just adjust one side to make the figures read even. You will still get tyre wear, but no where as much

[adaxo]

Ok will try that, thanks

[Eurospec]

Rear camber looks off, plus both rear wheels pointing in the same direction. Total thrust angle might be out?

Cheers,

BEn.

[frankyvr4]

if you put to much toe in on the rear then your car is not gonna feel as good around corners,if you have to much negative toe then its gonna feel like its all over the show(same with front),if you always have to have your equipment in the back then you have to get it aligned with the equipment in it!if you do not do it that way but need to have the tools in then your specs will change once its loaded and wear your tyres.i put bit more than needed +toe on the back with -camber and same with front and she sticks to the road like crazy!thrust angle will be out and should,if i have this rite,make the car feel like it wants to pull to the left a bit.

[VR457]

Where is the link to adjusting rear toe? I think i can attempt rear camber mod, just have to get hold of some decent bolts and washers.

Just checked the info i put on; its Left, -0.03 / Right, -0.11. I forgot the '-' when giving the left figure.

[VR457]

Rear toe adjustment info here: http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?54883-Rear-Toe-In&highlight=rear+toe

Post 2 says: You sure can adjust it. The track control arm (or at least that what im calling it) is the one at the back with a ball joint that faces up. on the subframe side its attached with an eccentric washer that has graduated marks on it. Slacken the nut and turn the bolt, simples

What does it mean? Picture would help if anyone has some.

[VR457]

Washer and bolt looks pretty simple but IMO isn't, I'm struggle to find longer bolts witch correct thread pitch and strength

Did you get some? If not, this might help - http://www.amazon.co.uk/1-25p-Metric-Fine-Pitch-Pack/dp/B004AVAKFU

[Louis]

Rear toe adjustment info here: http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?54883-Rear-Toe-In&highlight=rear+toe

Post 2 says: You sure can adjust it. The track control arm (or at least that what im calling it) is the one at the back with a ball joint that faces up. on the subframe side its attached with an eccentric washer that has graduated marks on it. Slacken the nut and turn the bolt, simples

What does it mean? Picture would help if anyone has some.

The ball joint goes back to a shaft. The shaft is on a concentric bolt at one end, (off centre hole, so you can turn it and then tighten it so it pushes the arm out or pulls it in slightly, it adjusts the rear toe.
I have concentric bolts fitted on the upper A arm, and use these to adjust the camber (not the washer mod, although it works the same)
I have the same on the front A arms and also an adjustable ball joint (slides in and out to adjust the camber), the concentric parts have poly bushes.