AYC failure?

[fassi1]

Just quick one.
None of the green lights comming up while driving hard around the bends and roundabouts.
Don't get red warning light and 3 green lights after turning ignition on come up and disappear.
Any ideas?

[aboo]

Does the red AYC light come on then go off when you turn on the ignition?

[fassi1]

No it doesn't.
Checked the fuse and it is ok.

[Ryan]

What happens when you drive around the bends? Can you feel the arse begin to step out and then be corrected or do you start to lose the rear?

[wintertidenz]

Check the AYC ECU behind/to the side of the glovebox. It may be disconnected, or have been removed.

[Subaru ETA]

Does the car even have AYC? Could not have it but had a hi vis dash fitted?

[fassi1]

Yes it does.
Im during lpg installation and, wiring and lpg ECU at the moment.
I diconnected battery and pulled plugs out from engine ECU.
Needed +12V after ignition so connected battery, turned ignition on and tested some of the pins in the plugs so at that moment engine ECU was disconnected and ignition was on.
Would that cause some trouble?

[foxdie]

Was it working before you started tampering / fitting the LPG kit?

[Wodjno]

Yes it does.
Im during lpg installation and, wiring and lpg ECU at the moment.
I diconnected battery and pulled plugs out from engine ECU.
Needed +12V after ignition so connected battery, turned ignition on and tested some of the pins in the plugs so at that moment engine ECU was disconnected and ignition was on.
Would that cause some trouble?

That shouldn't have caused the issue, but you never know. I don't think there is anything relating to AYC on the main ECU plugs. I have installed boost controllers and Piggy back ECU's all without disconnection of battery and never had any issues.
Instead of searching for 12v+ feed, you should have searched site for full ECU pinout diagram.

[pezza]

If you have a pump failure there is no way of finding out now without pulling the codes, as that red check light is not illuminating..

I can whizz by after work armed with evoscan to have a look.

From what you have done re wiring it doesn;t sound related but you never know.. hopefully evoscan will shed some light

[fassi1]

Yeah hopefully evoscan will tell.
I got really confused as it was ok when was dry ariund and it started to rain so my thoght was that caused some problem
and i sterted with lpg at the same time so i was lost with ideas whats wrong with it.
Ive converted many cars to lpg and ive done legnum too ;) but u never know.

[Gingerfish]

Does the red AYC light come on then go off when you turn on the ignition?

My red AYC light has been coming on intermittantly. Does that mean my ayc pump's playing up?

[foxdie]

fassi1 can you confirm if you see both red and green AYC lights pop up briefly when you turn the ignition on?

If you only see the green, then the red AYC bulb has blown or been removed (probably to hide a fault).

If you are seeing neither, that's a power or AYC ECU fault.

If you are seeing both, but then nothing afterwards, it could be a wiring fault (either to the engine ECU or sensors) or an AYC ECU fault.

Just as an afterthought to my last point, if the AYC ECU isn't seeing the throttle position sensor, or the gearbox speed sensor, it could potentially "think" that the car is stationary all the time and not be doing anything. The AYC ECU won't actually do anything if the vehicle is below a certain speed.

[foxdie]

My red AYC light has been coming on intermittantly. Does that mean my ayc pump's playing up?

Possibly yes, does it happen particularly after a long run?

What tends to happen is as the AYC fluid heats up, it thins out and the pressure drops, meaning the pump has to work harder. If the pressure switch (first thing to check) or the pump are failing, this would result in an intermittent fault.

[fassi1]

I do get only green lights popping up, no red light at all.
Dek mantioned that red light under the coolan gauge but tbh ive never seen one on my car since i bought it.
Sounds like bulb been taken out, rubbish:veryangry

[adaxo]

Take dash out and check, two screw holding plastic surround and 4 screw holding dash itself, 5 mins and we can look further if bulb is not present or burn.

[Gingerfish]

Possibly yes, does it happen particularly after a long run?

What tends to happen is as the AYC fluid heats up, it thins out and the pressure drops, meaning the pump has to work harder. If the pressure switch (first thing to check) or the pump are failing, this would result in an intermittent fault.

I havn't taken it on any particularly long runs recently, but the ayc fluid heating up makes a bit of sense as when I leave the car standing once the light comes on, the light goes out if I leave it for at least half an hour or so.

[fassi1]

Mark should know if there was red AYC warning light popping up after turning the ignition on, he has owned the car for 2 years.

[pezza]

if the fuse is dead I think that red light will fail to come on.... can take a look at that later mate

[fassi1]

That would b great. :)

[fassi1]

Red light bulb been taken out, confirmed by Mark.

[fassi1]

Thanks to Dek, got the diagnostics pluged in and faults were stored:
- vehicle speed sensor
- 81, pump relay

Is the pump relay the one hanging of the wheel arch right next to the battery?

[TAR]

Yes it is Chris.
:happy:


Thanks to Dek, got the diagnostics pluged in and faults were stored:
- vehicle speed sensor
- 81, pump relay

Is the pump relay the one hanging of the wheel arch right next to the battery?

[pezza]

Yes it is Chris.
:happy:

Good stuff...

Chris, if you can remember where you you relocated my relay you can test with mine .. esp whilst I need an ayc pump or switch?!?? :sigh:

Wodj... have you got a relay? If so, maybe can catch you weekend?

[pezza]

Thanks to Dek, got the diagnostics pluged in and faults were stored:
- vehicle speed sensor
- 81, pump relay

Is the pump relay the one hanging of the wheel arch right next to the battery?


Still need to find out about vehicle speed sensor issue /yes

[fassi1]

Very strange cause tested relay and is ok same as that 60 amp fuse. When i send power to the relay straight of the battery i can hear pump working so i dont understand now.

[pezza]

cud now be pump pressure which means that operation maybe intermittent... if you hear the pump stop say after 1 minute of drivng, then I guess you would noirmally see the red light come on. Are you able to replace bulb in dash? I am not sure how involved that is.. but should be easy job for you :D

[wintertidenz]

Replacing the bulb is easy enough - two screws for cluster surround, four holding it in, and then wiggle the dash out. Get new bulb, fit it in the right place and you're done.

15 minute job tops if you have the right bulb.

[fassi1]

Got that light back up and running. Used brake ligh warning light bulb for now as i didn't have one.
Where can i get one, Halfords?

Going back to problem the AYC warning light pops up and goes out after turning ignition on.
As soon as i start driving warning light pops up and stays on untill i turn ignition off.
Noticed tha warning light pops up only when i go over certain speed, wont pop up if i drive very slowly.

[wintertidenz]

Was the code 24 (via engine light), or the AYC light showing code 26?

[fassi1]

Hhmmm engine management light wasn't on. DeK was checking DTCs and i just took a photo of his screen and im not familiar with evoscan but my picture says:

Reading MUTII DTCs for EcuID:E7A4
Diagnostic Codes:Vehicle speed sensor.

I guess it is via engine ECU but DeK will know exactly.

[elnevio]

Don't use Evoscan for error code reading, it's not very good for that. Best way is to use the flashy dash method.

[fassi1]

Don't use Evoscan for error code reading, it's not very good for that. Best way is to use the flashy dash method.
Thanks. Will try that.

[elnevio]

Here's the guide, if you haven't found it:

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?45151-Reading-the-VR-4-s-Diagnostic-Codes

[fassi1]

Here's the guide, if you haven't found it:

http://www.clubvr4.com/forum/showthread.php?45151-Reading-the-VR-4-s-Diagnostic-Codes

Thanks for that.
That reminds me of my first car - Vauxhall cavalier :)

[fassi1]

I've found some interesting piece of wiring going to the vehicle speed sensor on the back of the gearbox right next to the rear bottom engine mount.
There is another connector before actual sensor connector.
What is that black flat part with 4 wires (black, red, yellow, white) wired up to sensor wiring?
Is that original part or been added for some reason?
One of this connections was loose, yellow wire seen on the picture.
Resoldered every single connection thinking that yellow loose wire was the reason of the problem but unfortunately AYC warning light is back :(

[adaxo]

converter from km to miles

[fassi1]

Thanks Adam.
Hopefully that resolved the problem with vss fault which was via engine ECU. Disconnected battery after resoldering everything, so interesting what coedes are gonna come up now.

[fassi1]

Tested everything today following troubleshooting for code no. 81: AYC relay system, and it looks like my AYC ECU is gone :(
Anybody has spare ECU to lend for a test? If everything works I'll be interested to buy that ECU.

[John TheAntique]

I've got a "spare" ECU in my footwel that is currently in use but if you want to pop over to Berko and plug it into yours to see if that is the problem you are welcome.

[fassi1]

That would b great. Ill def pop around this weekend as im very busy untill saturday afternoon.
Great as u r just arount the corner from me :)
Is urs exactly the same?

[Nick Mann]

I think the speed converters quite often throw up a speed sensor fault on the ECU. Also I suspect that cutting the speed limiter wire does the same. Neither of which are actually an issue.

ECU seems to be a good place to look if the relay, fuse and pump are all okay.

[John TheAntique]

I still think it is the relay but you can try mine when you come over.

[fassi1]

I wish it was relay, but i bypassed ECU and send +12V from battery straight to the relay and it clicks and pump kicks in so
telay is fine.
Speed sensor fault sorted, that was that loose connection on the converter.

[fassi1]

Big thanks to DeK for lending me his AYC ECU. Put it on my car and still no difference, AYC still not working. :(

[wintertidenz]

Check the wiring harness from the ECU to the pump relay - it could be a loose or cut wire, or a loose connector.

[fassi1]

Check the wiring harness from the ECU to the pump relay - it could be a loose or cut wire, or a loose connector.
Cheked, it is ok.

[John TheAntique]

I wish it was relay, but i bypassed ECU and send +12V from battery straight to the relay and it clicks and pump kicks in so
telay is fine.
Speed sensor fault sorted, that was that loose connection on the converter.

My relay did exactly the same. I checked it out on the bench, it clicked,the circuit was activated and it seemed fine but when, after many other abortive checks on the AYC system, I finally swopped it for another it showed that for some reason in situ it did not function so please, just for my peace of mind, try another before you go to the expensive remedy.

[pezza]

My relay did exactly the same. I checked it out on the bench, it clicked,the circuit was activated and it seemed fine but when, after many other abortive checks on the AYC system, I finally swopped it for another it showed that for some reason in situ it did not function so please, just for my peace of mind, try another before you go to the expensive remedy.

I agree, swap relay and double check earth. Take any readings you can take with meter. Compare the values to what you get on mine

[fassi1]

Yeah will do it.
I may try to get brand new one.

[fassi1]

I agree, swap relay and double check earth. Take any readings you can take with meter. Compare the values to what you get on mine
Yeah thats good idea, can do it at the weekend.

[John TheAntique]

Again, you are welcome to try mine at least I know it works.

[fassi1]

Again, you are welcome to try mine at least I know it works.
Thanks :thumbsup:

[fassi1]

Big thanks to John, put his relay on my car and still doesn't work. :)
Took differente root back home and put big smile on my face :) decat pipe was very well spend money :)

[fassi1]

Update.
Vehicle speed sensor fault is back.
As i was working on the car last night, managed to take speed sensor of the car just for the visual check up.
Once i had it on the bench i tested resistance between each combination of 2 pins out of 3 on the speed sensor, all the results were 0 ohm,
is that correct for fully working vehicle speed sensor?

[pezza]

There may be a testing procedure in the service manuals, indicating readings expected between pins.

the manuals will be on the club in the library somewhere but they are available online on a Russian website.

[wintertidenz]

I'd still be pointing my finger at the wiring or connectors - there could be a small cut in the sheathing of one of the wires which has let some water in.

If you get the car off the ground and put it in gear, then turn the wheel - do you get a voltage reading at the relay and pump?

[fassi1]

I'd still be pointing my finger at the wiring or connectors - there could be a small cut in the sheathing of one of the wires which has let some water in.

If you get the car off the ground and put it in gear, then turn the wheel - do you get a voltage reading at the relay and pump?

Good idea, Ill try that, but i already tested wiring from AYC ECU to the relay and there is conductivity.

[fassi1]

Very strange. We had 2 nice warm suny days, didnt drive yesday but drove it today and AYC was working.
I think i have to move to Spain or Italy :)

[fassi1]

Finally managed to sort out the problem with my AYC.
Due to lack of arch liners, slightly too big wheels (235/40 R18) and far too much lowered suspension by previous owners 3 wires been ruubed through above front left wheel
( ABS sensor wires and pump relay signal ). Previously repaired one of the wires by somebody but very poorly so as soon as water got there AYC was failling and ECU was throwing out code 81 pump relay.
All wrapped up properly and AYC is working in the rain too.
Happy days cause i was going to blame the pump or switch and start with fitting new switch.
:)

[adaxo]

/notworthy/bounce/megawoot/megawoot



well done.

[pezza]

Nice one... mystery finally sorted..

Funnily enough my AYC started working since the cold weather started within past 2 weeks or so, but it only works (red light stays out) for about 15 miles then gives up ??? One for another day I think