relocate AYC pump in to the boot?

[Davezj]

Anyonr ever thought of doing a relocation of APC pump into the boot. these guys do it EVO's so it can be any different for a VR4 and lets face it everybodies ATC pump is coroded to hell so if you refurb it or want it to last any more than a few more years why wounldl't you move it to the boot.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPkvWbLZ7M8

you could do it yourself for much less than they are charging all you need it the replacement flex fluid line and a couple of brackets.

[adaxo]

Great idea but over 400 for a bit of bracket and couple of pipes is a joke, as suggested on youtube comments, just wrap your refurbed pump and leave it there

[Davezj]

anything slung under the car with get wet and corrode it does not matter what you wrap it in. plus you have to make sure the heat can get for where the pump lives.
the boot is the safest place. but if you have just spent almost 2k on a replacement pump relocation is good option.

but even if i have just refurbished an AYC pump it takes a while to do and it is a lot of effort. It will only be a couple of years before it is all crusty again if it under the car.

you could get a plastic food box, one of the type with a silicone seal and clip flaps and mount that under the car somehow and fit the pump inside that, but in reality a relocation to the boot is only the cost of the extended flex fluid line and so rubber isolation mounts and small metal plate. the loom could be extended quite easily.

my AYC pump is not working at the moment and needs a refurb so it would be an ideal time to do a relocation because the pump will be off the car anyway.
might do a bit of googling for some extended flex lines.

[adaxo]

I have pump laying about waiting for refurb too, let me know where you get refurb kit from

[Davezj]

i am looking at few different kits but i am waiting to hear back from a guy that did a good refurb video. that one looks like it all the bits you need including the motor bearing and oil seal for the motor bearing.
plus the orings, bolts and stainless steel plate.

the last time ilooked at refurb kits they were about £100. but now they seem a bit more resonable.

[elnevio]

Dave, I wouldn't have thought you'd need to worry about cooling the AYC pump since it doesn't do a lot of work other than when the system is actually active. Even then, I think the fluid isn't stressed or really heated by much else other than perhaps a little bit of conduction through the diff casing/internals.

[Davezj]

That is a fair point nev. the pump does not run continuously.

i was looking at my pump the other day under the car and although i had cleaned the pump hanger a couple of years ago and treated the rust and cover the area with underseal it was still corroded to hell and the pump hanger is falling to bits.
i am going to need to replace the pump hanger as will most people with 1998 and older cars. so why not protect the pump for good and not have to worry about it again.
i have been watching some videos online of people who have rebuilt there pumps to working condition but you have to hack the pumps up a bit to get them apart, the refurb work is quite brutal which exposes parts of the pump which should be exposed to the elements. they have shown that if you just put the pump back in the same place in a couple of years the pump is back to square one needing a refurb.

so i think i am going to give it a go at some point when i refurb one of my AYC pumps.

i am surprised i have not moved the pump before now. it is probably situated in the worse position they could have placed it for corrosion issues. Bad mitsubishi, Bad mitsubishi.

[elnevio]

The plastic tub option (or a stainless steel box if you're feeling flush!) is probably a decent shout. Or surely there's enough room in the rear wing where the reservoir is located?

[Davezj]

The plastic tub option (or a stainless steel box if you're feeling flush!) is probably a decent shout. Or surely there's enough room in the rear wing where the reservoir is located?

i was thinking of the rear wing void as a possibility. but i a not sure how much space there actually is. my car is bit odd in this respect as i have a factory fit sub in the boot which means all the panels around that area have no openings in them, they are all covered by blanking plates to seal the sub box. i might look at removing the side storage tray in the back so the pump sits a bit lower and only need a small box putting over the top of it. as the starage tray is probably 2 or 3 inches deep to the floor of the car underneath the pastics.

[adaxo]

So is the sub extras have actually something more than a bracket for sub? Davezj it will explain why just fitting speaker and plug it to amp give me horrible sound.

[TAR]

I'm with you on this Dave. I think relocation to the boot is a good idea to preserve the pump and extend it's life. I'm looking forward to seeing what you come up with :happy:

[elnevio]

I'm with you on this Dave. I think relocation to the boot is a good idea to preserve the pump and extend it's life. I'm looking forward to seeing what you come up with :happy:

It's definitely hit and miss - daren't touch my pump, but it's done 70,000 in the 12.5 years since import, and it's not even needed the adjustable switch yet. It has always had Amsoil ATF in it in that time, maybe that's a factor. I know this is a slight tangent, but if you don't need to disturb it, there's possibly less need to relocate it. Though I have had the tow bar on, off then on again, thinking about it!

[TAR]

If you're going to the trouble of refurbishing the pump, you may as well protect it afterwards. I wouldn't worry otherwise. :happy:

[Davezj]

The metal work round the sub is reinforced and relatively thick metal panels cover all the openings. I can't get to the ayc reservoir behind the carpet panel without unbolting anther metal panel. Plus all the removable panels have a thick foam tape around them to stop the panel vibrating with the tunes. Personally don't use the sub as it was connected to the factory amp in the boot and had long since been removed as it was not connected to the after market stereo in the front.
I very rarely have the stereo on in the car anyway. So the sub is wasted on me, but it came with car.

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[ianturbo]

The metal work round the sub is reinforced and relatively thick metal panels cover all the openings. I can't get to the ayc reservoir behind the carpet panel without unbolting anther metal panel. Plus all the removable panels have a thick foam tape around them to stop the panel vibrating with the tunes. Personally don't use the sub as it was connected to the factory amp in the boot and had long since been removed as it was not connected to the after market stereo in the front.
I very rarely have the stereo on in the car anyway. So the sub is wasted on me, but it came with car.

Sent from my MI 5s using TapatalkDid you ever get round to doing this ? I've just got a replacement pump for mine .as like you say it water just rots them . I found the solenoids rattling about in the hanger on mine . [emoji55][emoji55]
Ian 82725

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[Davezj]

Like most things i come up with it was an idea to try but never got round to it.
there are braided flex pipes you can buy now on ebay that are about £70 a pair, but they would make the connection from a pump in the boot to the back of the diff.
but reservoir will still have to higher than the pump as it gravity feeds the pump when needed.

[ianturbo]

Like most things i come up with it was an idea to try but never got round to it.
there are braided flex pipes you can buy now on ebay that are about £70 a pair, but they would make the connection from a pump in the boot to the back of the diff.
but reservoir will still have to higher than the pump as it gravity feeds the pump when needed.Would the pipes not have to be longer as they are in the boot ? In the video they have turned the pump round so the pipes are on the rear [emoji848][emoji848]

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[Davezj]

the pipes are replace with longer flex ones that are feed through the floor of the boot.

something like these, but i dont know what length you woud need
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HEL-Performance-Braided-AYC-Lines-Hoses-Pipes-For-Mitsubishi-Lancer-Evo-4-5-6/202574141263

[Kryndon]

Have any of you in the recent past ordered the AYC rebuild kit from the Croatian guy (who has a good video on Youtube on how to repair it)? Aside from him, the only other option seems to be the kit from Evolution-Hydraulics UK. Kit looks exactly the same and for the same price.

P.S has anyone managed to actually mount the pump inside the trunk and to the left of the access panel for the reservoir? I reckon on a Legnum there should be enough room to mount it securely over there and run extended flex lines to the diff.

[Davezj]

which kit are you looking at links would be usful.
there are various types of kits not all of them have all the parts needed, some have motor bearings some without some with just motor seals some without.
some kits with all the screws needed some without.
so just be careful you order the kit that has everything included.

[Kryndon]

Well the Croatian fella doesn't have a direct link to a website or anything, and so far he hasn't responded to my emails so I reckon he's not doing these kits anymore. Here's the video anyhow: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrYjQat4KGE

As for the Evo-Hydraulics kit, this is the one: https://www.evolution-hydraulics.com/product-page/evo-4-9-repair-service-kit I asked them whether it would work specifically on Legnum AYCs, and they confirmed.

[Davezj]

the kit you linked to looks like it is a full kit it has the motor bearing and seal etc.

it looks familiar, but that is because i have the exact same kit sat in front of me in my pile of things to do.

[Kryndon]

Small update, I never ordered the kit since I was away on work. I got a spare pump from a buddy. It was also corroded but I managed to take it all apart. Honestly looking at the kit, it's just 3 new bolts, some standard sized orings and a plate. I managed to take the whole plate out and will be making a dxf (digital drawing) of it and having it laser cut from stainless. New bolts and o-rings are pretty much free. I reckon the plate wont cost me much either since it's a small piece of steel and a 10 second zap job on the cutter. The more expensive thing would be getting two new flex lines ran from the diff all the way up into the boot. All in all I reckon it would cost me way less than ordering these kits and paying VAT + tariffs (stupid Brexit).

I hope I'll manage to rebuild and install it before new years. If it ends up working I'll upload the drawing for the plate here so you guys can have 'em made for yourselves.

[Davezj]

what you are paying for is a all the R&D time that has gone into developing this kit.
plus they are on offer at the moment £70 plus £4 shipping.

i would have thought you could buy the individual parts for about £50 if you know the exact sizes you need to buy.
depends if you can get all the parts in small enough quantities to make it viable to buy the parts for just one kit.
they are not charging an outrageous price for the kit.

however i would be interested in a drawing of the pump plate.

[Kryndon]

Alright so I had a go at it, pulled the ol' China trick on the plate and straight up copied it then had it laser cut. It fit perfect first time around, 3mm thick stainless. I looked into how the pump itself works and builds pressure, and essentially the pump plate thickness does not matter; it's the two ring gears and their ratio that affects the pressure output. Also you have to be careful to orient the plate as from the factory, which has the wider end of the flow grooves facing AWAY from the pump body. Or if you're uncertain, just look at the top part (where the center shaft and oil seal are), because that has the same indentation that follow the plate curves; you can't mix it up!

We knew the pump had to be installed in the boot since first of all it's a Legnum so you've got all the room in the world. Secondly, I didn't want corrosion, salt, water and potential debris to be a factor in this pump's remaining life, so we put 'er up. It's not the most elegant mounting solution, and we basically had to make do with whatever brackets and bolts we had laying around. The picture I will show is test fitting and in reality it ended up being very stiff and proper looking. If my brother wasn't in such a rush to drive off, I would have painted the bracketry black and would have made a box-like cover with some boot lining on top to fully enclose the pump, but that remains for another day.

Also, you will notice we retained the original plastic side tray. I removed the two plastic inserts (where the screws thread into), and inserted two long M8 bolts with washers on both sides to make it flush and sturdy. So basically the mounting is Bracket -> plastic tray -> boot floor - > washer+nut. There was an option to run more reinforcement underneath and triangulate the mounting between all 4 existing factory holes, but again, he was in a rush and there wasn't enough time. As for the pump reservoir, it was simply moved as high up and towards the brake lights as possible, while having easy access to open the cap and fill while looking into it. Most important thing here is to MAKE SURE the reservoir and its 2 lines are above the highest point of the pump and pressure lines. You can sort of see this in the picture. This allows any air to travel back up to the highest point, which is the reservoir.

And, again, there wasn't enough time, but the factory side panel that covers the reservoir and wheel arch would need very little trimming to make it fit. A small incision would need to be cut at the corner so both reservoir lines can pass through it. And the small opening would need to be cut up just a bit to allow the high pressure lines to pass (or if we had made them a tad longer, they can be pointed more to the right and completely pass through the existing panel hole). As for the underneath mounting, same as OEM, however it starts with two copper pipes from the diff, then is hard crimped onto a reinforced flex line going through the original two-holed grommet and coming up and into the pump. We hand-bent the pipes. Total length of pressure hoses is 1.4 meters from end to end, but I would advise to make it 1.45 or even 1.5 meters long to allow for a better fitment up top. Or if you can, use some AN style 90 degree fittings.

Now, with all this said and done, I'm left uncertain whether the pump works properly now. I believe we were not able to properly bleed it from air so it would need to be done gradually by driving around and cracking open the bleed nipples down at the diff to release air. I tried with Evoscan 2.6 and the modded VAG 1.3 cable with pin 9 removed, but the AYC actuators simply did not want to communicate. I also tried just starting an AYC Datalog and stopping it in hopes that it would trigger the pump, but it didn't. I manually tested the pump by supplying 12 volts to the motor and it spins freely. I also applied 12 volts to each solenoid and they all click. Even poured more fluid right into the feed hose. I took it round the block once then came back and cracked open the bleeders. The right side bleeder did release air, but the left only released fluid. This makes sense because I only did like 5 right hand turns and came back into the garage. So there is definitely fresh fluid traveling through the system, and air being trapped down at the nipple and waiting to be released. The most important thing is that the permanent red AYC light COMPLETELY disappeared. Before that, we were getting at least three AYC codes, including a code 72 with is right side solenoid short.

My brother then drove off home and he said on the way back the red light never came on but he didn't really drive the car properly to see if the AYC bars would light up. So, in conclusion, I am confident the new plate and pump assembly is properly done. I believe all that's left is to keep bleeding the system and take it for a nice rip through the countryside to verify if it does indeed work. It seems I am not able to attach the plate drawing I made in .dxf form here in this comment, so if you want to tinker with it, send me a PM and I will send it through Email. Feel free to go and have it cut out and test it yourself. Or you can print it 1:1 scale then compare with the original plate if it's still intact. All in all, everything including hoses, plate, bolts and orings cost me right around 30 quid. Not including the MOTUL ATF fluid and labor, which is free because he's my brother and I'm a sucker for these cars.

EDIT: After 2 more drives around and cracking open both nipples twice, all remaining air was evacuated and now the system works fully! During intensive cornering all 3 AYC bars light up and the steering stiffens, car feels like on rails! If anybody in the EU reading this would like me to fab up a kit for them (orings bolts plate) let me know!

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[A1player]

I am in the process of having my AYC pump fully rebuilt and then been fitted in the boot of my
Mitsubishi Galant VR4 Estate Ralliart 2001 Type-S 5d Auto
Will update this as the job progresses with costs and review after finished job.
PS
The company who are doing this for me do offer a life time guaranteed when they rebuild the unit and fitted in the boot.