Brakes for Nurburgring

Hi all,
I plan to take my recently acquired Legnum on a roadtrip through Germany in September, including hopefully a bit of tourist driving on the Nurburgring..
For peace of mind, I'm thinking I probably ought to throw some new pads and discs at the car. I'm not a racer, I don't want or need race brakes or suspension, just don't like the idea of going around the ring on older unknown kit!
eBay has plenty of options, but just wondering if anybody can attest to anything? EBC is twice the price of the cheap stuff, but maybe the cheap stuff would do just fine? Just looking for recommendations if anybody has any? Would be much appreciated.
Also, I tried to get in touch with Area52 Motorsport in Nottingham about some mapping (facebook messaged, called, left a message etc) as I saw they've catered to the club in the past, but nobody there has got back to me yet. Does anybody on the forum have a direct line to anybody there or do I just need to keep chasing them?
Cheers!
Ben

I certainly wouldn't like "stock" brakes, EBC YellowStuff seemed to be a good price/performance ratio, without going to full on race brakes (like Carbotech XP-8)


All of our stuff at Area 52 has been us renting the dyno, they've not actually done any of the mapping itself.

Stock calipers will fade badly if you're pressing on around the track. I had a few scary moments whilst enjoying spirited drives before I upgraded to Brembo's with decent pads.

Ferodo DS2500 or DS Performance pads may be a good choice on the stock calipers. :happy:

The ring is surprisingly easy on brakes. EBC yellowstuff would be a good shout IMO. Also make sure you renew the fluid - if that is a few years old it will be fading fast as it heats up.

Have fun! And watch a load of youtube videos on ring crashes before you drive it - that should keep you in check!!

Well, I've ordered all the parts, but the plan looks like its scuppered. After two hour of driving it at the weekend it started overheating at low revs, and the next day the temp is showing just below horizontal.. The original overheating made me think water pump, and then the low temp suggests the thermostat or both are knackered. I'm working through it now, but having never worked on an engine like this before everything seems to be taking a lot longer than planned.. Not sure I'm going to have the time to get it sorted :(

Better you found the overheating issue now rather than on the continent where it tends to be a tad warmer!

It is normal for the temperature gauge to sit just below horizontal. "About half past 8" is correct.

When pushing on, and putting a lot of heat into the turbos, this heat is transferred via the oil and water to the engine's cooling system - it's pretty good, about 10-15 minutes on track is about when I expect the temperature gauge to creep up. I know Lucas did both short and long journeys, and drove it like it was designed to be and like a granny, and didn't have any overheating issues with it (otherwise he'd have likely been on the phone to me asking for some help!) - and I didn't experience that when I borrowed it, either, so it's surprising to hear you've had this so soon :(

The dash temperature gauge is fed via this sensor - for the sake of £7.50 (at current price) I'd be tempted to change it and see if the problem remains.

Be careful, you will struggle with standard callipers even with some decent DS2500s which are probably the best pad for a VR4.
A quite lap can be easy on the brakes but if there is a lot of traffic you will be using the brakes a lot to get out of the way or avoid anyone’s cock up in front of you. Be aware there are some Irish nutters out there !

I used DS2500 on my VR-4 and did not loose my brakes but prob not pushing on as much as others

Unless you are on track day it is prob harder now to get extended clear track and not have to brake/move out of the way of other traffic

If it's a first trip you would prob not be pushing on and work the brakes as hard as others

Going as fast as you can along anything resembling a 'straight' and then braking hard for any bend will certainly wear the brakes much more

But if first visit, such driving may see you going off the track perhaps within first few bends and all that might entail...

Get car sorted and perhaps wait to go with some people from here with experience of the place and then share laps/follow people to get an idea of the place...

And have a LOT more fun

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nick Mann

The ring is surprisingly easy on brakes. EBC yellowstuff would be a good shout IMO. Also make sure you renew the fluid - if that is a few years old it will be fading fast as it heats up.

Have fun! And watch a load of youtube videos on ring crashes before you drive it - that should keep you in check!!

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Listen to this man.:scholar:

He knows a bit about braking :afro:

Quick update -
Loaded up on parts from Viamoto (never used them before, but Mike seemed really helpful and had everything required)

Went with EBC yellowstuff, new set of discs all round and all the belt kits and water pump and thermostat..
Thought I'd have a crack at the thermostat myself but quickly realised getting to that second bolt is a lot more involved than I was expecting, and as I was away with the wife for her birthday for a few days I took the easy option and put it in with a local garage.. picking it up tomorrow. Going to run it down to see my brother on Tuesday and that'll be a 6 hour round trip, so I'll know if its resolved..

I got a couple of laps in at Nurburging last year, and it was bonkers. I rented a stripped out/prepped Golf, but got unlucky. Accidents and closed ring meant lots of waiting and when I got on every Porsche and BMW driver in the world wanted to overtake. I had an instructor with me, but it didn't help much when everybody is trying to force their way through.

This time I want to try and do some of the evening sessions, and also hang around all day on a Sunday and see if I can find some clear track to make the most of it

I have no plans to go anywhere near the armco.. That's an expensive mistake! So I'll take it easy

Thanks Garry!

Its unfortunate, but not a bad thing overall. Even if it was just that sensor, I like the peace of mind having the cambelt and waterpump documented.... The car had no service history, so I'd have done them anyway. This just speeded up that process..

If the car goes well in the next couple days, I'll be booking the ferry!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Confused

It is normal for the temperature gauge to sit just below horizontal. "About half past 8" is correct.

When pushing on, and putting a lot of heat into the turbos, this heat is transferred via the oil and water to the engine's cooling system - it's pretty good, about 10-15 minutes on track is about when I expect the temperature gauge to creep up. I know Lucas did both short and long journeys, and drove it like it was designed to be and like a granny, and didn't have any overheating issues with it (otherwise he'd have likely been on the phone to me asking for some help!) - and I didn't experience that when I borrowed it, either, so it's surprising to hear you've had this so soon :(

The dash temperature gauge is fed via this sensor - for the sake of £7.50 (at current price) I'd be tempted to change it and see if the problem remains.

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Ended up with about 7 hours of driving on Tuesday evening as I hit roadworks/diversions coming home on the M4, M25 and M11..! But no temp problems.
Did get a flickering oil can when static but only after 3 hours of driving, and ABS light after 4 hours of driving.. Both disappeared the morning after/when cold
So, I’m suspicious the oil pressure sender is faulty having read a thread in the forum about the oil pump being quite unlikely to fail (and the engine seems to run fine with no bad noises), and I assume there is probably a split or degraded reluctor ring, which when hot causes the ABS fault.
The ABS fault isn’t ideal and I’ll try and get that resolved tomorrow, but overall I think it’s good enough to travel.
So.. ferry is now booked..!

That's great news!

I would say oil pressure switch is a definite thing to swap out - it's a ~£10 part, and is likely to be the cause. At least if you replace it and it's not, you'll know it's not just that!

The ABS light will come on if it detects a fault again, but may have the code stored - you can do Flashy Dash to see if it's indicating which wheel - but again, reluctor rings are about £15 each.

Have a fun trip, be sure to post up some photos/videos!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vr4suffolk

I got a couple of laps in at Nurburging last year, and it was bonkers. I rented a stripped out/prepped Golf, but got unlucky. Accidents and closed ring meant lots of waiting and when I got on every Porsche and BMW driver in the world wanted to overtake. I had an instructor with me, but it didn't help much when everybody is trying to force their way through.

This time I want to try and do some of the evening sessions, and also hang around all day on a Sunday and see if I can find some clear track to make the most of it

I have no plans to go anywhere near the armco.. That's an expensive mistake! So I'll take it easy

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Sunday afternoons tend to be quiet with the usual weekend crowd either having had enough or departing home. First hours of TF from 8-9am also tend to be quiet, but beware the damp spots as especially coming into Autumn they can take longer to warm up. Otherwise its pot luck to lap quietly....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vr4suffolk

I got a couple of laps in at Nurburging last year, and it was bonkers. I rented a stripped out/prepped Golf, but got unlucky. Accidents and closed ring meant lots of waiting and when I got on every Porsche and BMW driver in the world wanted to overtake. I had an instructor with me, but it didn't help much when everybody is trying to force their way through.

This time I want to try and do some of the evening sessions, and also hang around all day on a Sunday and see if I can find some clear track to make the most of it

I have no plans to go anywhere near the armco.. That's an expensive mistake! So I'll take it easy

---

Sunday afternoons tend to be quiet with the usual weekend crowd either having had enough or departing home. First hours of TF from 8-9am also tend to be quiet, but beware the damp spots as especially coming into Autumn they can take longer to warm up. Otherwise its pot luck to lap quietly....

What weekend you heading over? Im there a lot and its very rare to see a VR4 in any shape or form. Only saw one German Plated saloon last year....

Aiming for Nurburgring on Sunday 18th September, and around that weekend.. some driving to do around Germany beforehand.

Any recommendations for track day insurance?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vr4suffolk

Aiming for Nurburgring on Sunday 18th September, and around that weekend.. some driving to do around Germany beforehand.

Any recommendations for track day insurance?

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You won’t get insurance for tourist laps at the ring.
Only certain organised track days there (much more expensive than general admission) could you get insured, but probably not even worth it on a low value vehicle due to cost.
Again - look out for those Irish nutters (like the one above) !

A belated update:

I’m sorry to report that the Nurburgring visit didn’t happen. Developed a transmission leak, which I noticed just before boarding the outward ferry, and thought I’d better not take the risk going near a track.

I drove it to Hamburg and back though, keeping a regular eye on the fluids, and it performed well all things considered.

I presume it’ll be a transmission out job to resolve.. As an interim step I’ve thrown some Rislone in it hoping that’ll do some good..

It also developed a droning from the rear right side on the return journey, presumably a bearing.. I’ve replaced the two fronts already, might as well do the lot of them!

But despite all the new issues, still chuffed to have the car on the driveway.. at least until I find out how much a transmission rebuild is going to cost..

Torque converter seal is a common place for them to leak - about a £10 seal but it is a gearbox out job, so time consuming.

That's my assumption too, I saw some posts about it being a weak point.. Oh well. Onwards and upwards

If the ATF leak is comeing from the bellhousing then it will be the torque converter seal on the input shaft. This is one of the most common failure points on the car. It is a gearbox out job to rectify, but the seal is not expensive.

Drone at the back sounds very likely to be a bearing.

Sorry - I should read the second page before I reply!!

:)

It was indeed the bearing. Just had both rear hubs done and it’s smooth and quiet now. Gearbox leak seems to have settled down.. maybe the rislone did rejuvenate that seal..?! I wasn’t expecting much from it. I’ll keep an eye on it!

Next stop, the oil leaks..