being non paying member sucks

[valmes]

Restrictions on the members area, articles section is a good example here, the information is available out which the members area, providing you can be bothered looking for it. The members area provides nicely written articles, which members have spent their time written, these contain all the relevant information in one easy post. However, if you save 20 quid, you can go search the forums. We are not restricting access to information, its all out there, but in the members are its just in one location.

Do we really have to go into this? You are not restricting access to information? Huhh? I can't even read the link you've provided... My post is in there, right?

[Spirit]

You are not restricting access to information? Huhh? I can't even read the link you've provided... My post is in there, right?

How can you say we are restricting access ? This website is owned by Barry - it's up to him what he does with it. If it didn't exist then where would you get most of the juicy info posted on here......you would struggle !

If Barry wants to he could make this a subscription only website - no-one is forced to come here. It's not as though he (or anyone else) is making money out of this. CVR4 is a proper club, and we are not allowed to make a personal profit from its funds. Any profit made is re-invested in the club in other ways.

If people don't want to pay to become a full member then thats cool, but we have been around 3 years now and the club is bigger and better than ever - sh1t we must be doing something wrong !

[valmes]

sh1t we must be doing something wrong !

Didn't I just said that? j/k... you are obviously not getting my point...

where would you get most of the juicy info posted on here......you would struggle !

... Yeah... and I would struggle to post juicy info too... wouldn't I?

And that's exactly my point - getting all info out, might get you more paying members than keeping "juicy stuff" inside the members only area, but it's your club and it's up to you what you do with it. Good luck.

PS: I will just lurk around from time to time as a registered user... if you don't mind. I promise, I won't bother you anymore, with any opinions of mine...

BTW, I really think Barry did a great thing creating this place, but there are still things you can improve on... are we allowed to say what's on our mind after a year of membership? Does it come with the package?

[WildCards]

Easy Valmes, I don't think anyone is trying to alienate you mate, you're more than welcome AFAIC to stay around. You do have a right to your own opinion of course, but this subject has been covered many times before, each time the same conclusion is reached, and either side of the fence agrees to disagree.

Personally, i didn't realise you had to pay so much, but Barry has already mentioned this, otherwise £20 is bugger all, It keeps nobheads off the site and worthy users on.

Also, relying on donations is risky business, what if enough donations aren't made one month? Who pays then?

[BraindG]

BTW, I really think Barry did a great thing creating this place, but there are still things you can improve on... are we allowed to say what's on our mind after a year of membership? Does it come with the package?

You may say whats on your mind, however i feel there should be a correct way of doing so, Posting in the "Club VR4 Membership Info/Queries" forum is a start, that what its there for.

Im not trying to chase you, or anyone away, far from it. But, I'd rather not start reading a thread, about x, only for comments regarding Y to be brandished, saying they have issues and no-one cares, when in fact they have never been raised before, or correctly..

Its like going to a shop and joining in on an arguement that someone is having with another customer. Then stating the shop is rubbish because they never responded to a problem you had with the product you bought, and also, they didn't give you the correct discount for the product you purchased. When, on further investigation, the product was bought, a wimper was hear at the back of the shop one day regarding the problem with the product. And nothing was ever said about the discount to anyone working at the shop.

[mpau009]

Im sure there will be plenty of replies, so i'll leave it there.

Told you so... Munta what have you done

There is some real emotion out there, and fair enough, imagine the work and personal hours that goes/ has gone into building a site like this, iv got nothing but respect.

My argument, Once again, there are far worse ways to spend $20, and like Booyah says, if its not worth it for you, just don't rejoin. All i can say is under 6cents a day, have personally saved over $200 on servicing at Auckland Motors (going there again on Friday) all my questions are answered, usually with handy pics, that someone has taken their time to write up, i have had my moneys worth..

I think the forum is as worthwhile as you want it to be...

Now quick join up...

(ps i think a donations page couldn't hurt?)

[bradc]

As long as you don't leave Valmes, we all value your input and the creation of your twin TD04 monster. It is a little annoying that you have to pay so much, but as Barry said, we are just too small to give the whole club away for free.

[amsoil]

Don't know if it helps or whether I should keep quiet but cant people just transfer funds via pay pal; It would keep 'other ' costs down and if the club can't do it then send the funds to my account LOL I'll send the club a cheque or transfer the money, promise . L O L

So theres an offer Valmes if you want you can transfer whatever to me and I'll forward to the club therby cutting the costs you describe in half . Just remember to add 4% so you don't cost me money in saving you money!

[Kenneth]

I believe that there are generally 2 sorts of members (there IS a scale between these two poles though, so you dont neccesarily have to be exacly one or the other)

1) Chiefs: these people lead the way, do their own work, search out information, post articles, help other members, organise stuff etc. Chiefs do this out of a willingness to share their information and help others

2) Indians: take the stuff provided by the chiefs and use it gaining much from the work the chiefs do.


As I said, there is a scale between the 2, but hopefully you get the idea.

This site (and many others) is not such a great help to the chiefs as they are the ones poineering the information. But they do it out of good-will and because that is the way they are.
If you are one of these, then sure the membership fee might not be attractive to you.

On the other hand, if you are more an indian, then the membership fee will be more than make up for by the information and assistance that you recieve.

If you expect to recieve something, then you may be dissapointed.

Personally I come here more for the people. My membership has paid itsself back many times over... but not from the information, instead from the purchase of cheap 2nd hand parts from other NZ members.

[KiwiTT]

I am inclined to say an old credit card advert "Membership has it's benefits". My discounts on servicing has saved me the membership many times over each year.

[jervis]

England - 124
New Zealand - 45
Scotland - 12
Wales - 6
USA - 1
Belgium - 1
Estonia - 2
Cyprus - 1
Rep. Of Ireland - 2
Australia - 1
Northern Ireland - 1
Sweden - 1

Total FULL membership - 198

surely 198 entusiastic VR4 owners can't be wrong..

[The Vee]

Don't want to make this go on and on, but while I appreciate it's more difficult for overseas members, the "fee" is paid back a thousand times over for all the interest, friendship, events and info this club provides. To me it's more of a way to support a club and keep it going as inevitably there are costs to run such a thing. My real concern though, is Valmes' comment about his pack. I spend hours doing these things and take pride in the fact that nearly all get dispatched immediately after the details are recieved and the cards made. I can categorically assure you that packs were sent. I will enquire as to whether or not I can do a recorded/guaranteed delivery to you (Valmes) and if so, get it organised with a new pack at my own cost, if you so wish. Just to be clear, I'm talking about the pack, not the membership fee.

[Spirit]

Don't know if it helps or whether I should keep quiet but cant people just transfer funds via pay pal; It would keep 'other ' costs down and if the club can't do it then send the funds to my account LOL I'll send the club a cheque or transfer the money, promise . L O L

We already use paypal, but IIRC you can't in Russia

[Louis]

Restrictions on the members area, articles section is a good example here, the information is available out which the members area, providing you can be bothered looking for it. The members area provides nicely written articles, which members have spent their time written, these contain all the relevant information in one easy post. However, if you save 20 quid, you can go search the forums. We are not restricting access to information, its all out there, but in the members are its just in one location.


QUOTE"We are not restricting access to information, its all out there, but in the members area its just in one location."

Hi, Could someone explain the above statement?, as far as I am aware if something is put in the "members area" it is then out of reach of non members, Am I wrong?.
If the info is not hidden but just easier to find then Munta does not have a problem as, if the info is accessable you just have to search

I have read all through this post, and agree with some bits and disagree with others, personally I disagree with a charge, but I do understand that things cost money and people take the time out of their own lives to organise the site.

I think people like Valmes contribute a lot of useful information to the site ( and pay for the privelidge to share their info with others), But, I suppose in return you learn from posts that other people have put up. But sometimes it is not always a good balance of giving and getting.

I don't see why it costs different amounts to join depending on which country you are in, surely it should be the same cost for all?

I think “Don't like it, then don't come back”, is definitely the wrong attitude.

It’s not about a keyring!, it’s about access to info and whether it should be paid for.

[KiwiTT]

Hi, Could someone explain the above statement?, as far as I am aware if something is put in the "members area" it is then out of reach of non members, Am I wrong?.

Even if you search this site you can not access the member articles. However, if you want to search the internet and gather the information yourself, you can. However, you need to know what you are searching for. If you value your time, the ease of finding the information is facilitated by other members collating and preparing articles for placement in the members area.

[valmes]

You may say whats on your mind, however i feel there should be a correct way of doing so, Posting in the "Club VR4 Membership Info/Queries" forum is a start, that what its there for.

Im not trying to chase you, or anyone away, far from it. But, I'd rather not start reading a thread, about x, only for comments regarding Y to be brandished, saying they have issues and no-one cares, when in fact they have never been raised before, or correctly..

Its like going to a shop and joining in on an arguement that someone is having with another customer. Then stating the shop is rubbish because they never responded to a problem you had with the product you bought, and also, they didn't give you the correct discount for the product you purchased. When, on further investigation, the product was bought, a wimper was hear at the back of the shop one day regarding the problem with the product. And nothing was ever said about the discount to anyone working at the shop.

I just noticed it was a NZ chat section... my bad.

I didn't say "the shop was rubbish" - never. I did rise my opinion on "access to the info" part... and other services "the shop" was offering for a fee.

I did post on a couple of occasions of that "lost/forgotten" key ring – I didn’t complain since I really didn’t need it… just wanted to know what it is... sorry I can't access membership area to find where I've posted... neither do I want to go into it.

I just hope that after "I search the internet and gather the information myself" and post it on here, it won't be moved to the "members only area", right?
... or "don't come back" is the only option I've got now?

Limiting the "hard to find info" to two hundred people is in no way helping our platform (VR-4)! So again my point is – paying to support the community is ok. Paying to keep the info restricted to “members only” is not…

However current customers/members can vote with their money, so I will leave it there...

[The Vee]

[QUOTE=valmes]I

I did post on a couple of occasions of that "lost/forgotten" key ring – I didn’t complain since I really didn’t need it… just wanted to know what it is... sorry I can't access membership area to find where I've posted... neither do I want to go into it.

Yes I know you did and a replacement was sent. Lost yes, forgotten no. While this is not the bigger issue in your post, my offer still stands from the last post I made.

[detonate]

Hell I'm going to pay $20 just for the stickers :

heh

But really, how can you *honestly* complain about a $20 membership? It's just mind boggelling

[Wodjno]

I agree that the Membership Fee for this Club is a "Piddle" in the Ocean !! ( Zilch, Squat, Diddly, Nada, Nuffin )
And i use the word "PIDDLE" for a very good reason..
If this topic had been discussed on any other Forum their would have been much stronger language and abuse used than has been in this thread "SO FAR"
"PIDDLE is the strongest word that has so far been used in this thread..
What i'm trying to say is that, maybe it's because of the way the Membership System works on CLUBVR4 that not just every TOM, DICK or HARRY frequents the site and rants and raves and hurls abuse like on most other sites..
At the end of the day IMHO i think it comes down to how much Membership actually costs..

For those who drink alchohol ! If you drank 1 less Pint, Glass of Wine or Short per week how much money would you save ? Would this pay for your Membership !

For those of you who smoke ! If you smoked 1 less cigarette a day, how much money would that save ? Would that pay for your membership..!

For those of you who eat chocolate ! If you ate 1 less bar of chocolate a week, how much would you save ? Would that pay for your membership !

Also do any of the above gain you a wealth of information and possibly save you 100 x that amount ?

This topic can be argued out over and over again. But at the end of the day you pays your money and you takes your choice.

Specifically aimed at Valmes, i sympathise with your problem of not being able to pay your membership as easy as everbody else and in such circumstances like this as it is not directly your fault then i think something should be sorted out through the club so you are not paying Over the Top..

WODJNO

[bradc]

detonate, so hurry up and pay If you give dickytim your $20 on sunday, he'll sort it all out for you.