TD04 Bolt on Kit Designing and Manufacturing

[Turbo_Steve]

I was under the impression that the BMW versions are "somewhat integrated" into the manifolds.

And why would we want TD03s, anyway? TD04s are definitely, DEFINITELY the way forward. Unless you want TD05s.

[WildCards]

And why would we want TD03s, anyway?

You wouldn't, but the BMW x35i engine is sold in the US, so there is a fair chance interesting stuff will be developed, and 'maybe' some of that could be easily or easier to adapt to use in a VR4 no?

[Gowf]

Are the BMW's not sequential turbos? I was also under the impression that the hot side was an integral part of the manifold, so i wouldnt say they were a goer at all.

Its been said time and time again...... Just use the subaru turbos, it will save you a lot of hassle. But then what would i know?

[Turbo_Steve]

What, with your GTO setup? Naarfink


I'm with Gowf: as far as I am aware subaru turbos on factory manifolds seems to be the way forward...why would you want to make it more complicated?
It sounds like Valmes got them in without bulkhead mods, or even doing much to the radiator. The issue then is just oil and water lines, inlet pipework and downpipes.


Unless someone comes up with an awesomely brilliant compressor side and compatible turbine wheel for the BMW (basically a TD04 that fits into a TD03 turbine scroll) then this isn't really of much interest to us.

[Gowf]

What, with your GTO setup? Naarfink


I'm with Gowf: as far as I am aware subaru turbos on factory manifolds seems to be the way forward...why would you want to make it more complicated?
It sounds like Valmes got them in without bulkhead mods, or even doing much to the radiator. The issue then is just oil and water lines, inlet pipework and downpipes.

There were minor mods to the bulhead from what i remember talking to him about it, which is why i was shocked when i saw how much room there is at the back using the GTO ones, but then i did have custom manifolds.

Ive just got to say what i have time and time over. It never seems like much, oil/water lines/ downpipes etc, but it all adds up and youve got to see if it is a viable commercial project, there is no point in doing it unless people are going to pay the money.

Here's an idea, how about a pole, crude and by no way a true representation of peoples opinions when it comes down to it, as to how much people would be prepared to pay for TD04 conversion kit (so fitting/ecu/mapping/fueling all not included)?

Just to put it in perspective, this free ps pump conversion that ive been doing has so far cost me about£120 due to pipework and electronic bits and bobs.... Its amazing what the little bits cost.

[Turbo_Steve]

Absoloutely: I say "only" in terms of fabricating, rather than cost!!!

Wasn't Valmes running TD05s? They're a fair bit bigger!

[Gowf]

he ran TD04 HL's first though before the td05's

[WildCards]

Are the BMW's not sequential turbos? I was also under the impression that the hot side was an integral part of the manifold, so i wouldnt say they were a goer at all.

Its been said time and time again...... Just use the subaru turbos, it will save you a lot of hassle. But then what would i know?

I haven't a clue mate, I'm simply repeating what i've heard elsewhere so possibly someone with more technical brain matter can put the info to some use. At least it can be considered and binned instead of found out afterwards.

[Ryan]

Are the BMW's not sequential turbos? I was also under the impression that the hot side was an integral part of the manifold, so i wouldnt say they were a goer at all.

Its been said time and time again...... Just use the subaru turbos, it will save you a lot of hassle. But then what would i know?

Here is a picture of the manifolds for the BMW engine:



In situ:

[Turbo_Steve]

Oh-h that's beautiful! Nice find Ryan!

And yeup, thems are two teeny turbos fused to the manifolds, running in paralell (not sequential) and, interestingly, with the biggest actuators in the world: they're nearly as big as the compressor housing!

The other interesting spot is the device next to the spark plug in the cylinder top....at first I thought it was cylinder-direct injection, but I can't see the fuel rail...looks more like a pyrometer?

[scott.mohekey]

The fuel rail might be the black thing above it, no? It's sectioned so you wouldn't see the rest of the near end.

[Turbo_Steve]

The only black bit I can see above it looks like an electrical connector to me?
The long black ribbed bit is connected to some inlet pipework, so it's ain't fuel in there

I want to play with it now

[Ryan]

I would really like to have a go driving one

[Gowf]

A friend of mine has a '58 335. They are quite quick, i had a play with it in a standard vr4, and i must say they are a good bit quicker. Lovely to drive, as most bmw's are, but its just a bit false.... it just takes lot of feel away from the driver.

He also has had injector issues already. A common fault aparently, but the service he recieved from BMW was apauling.

Sorry, this is a total thread hijack. Needless to say, those turbos are a definate no go and would be damn expensive

[VR4WGN]

ok well heres the 2 turbos guys
iv slowly got the kit together and am still busy trying.
i want to make up a stand that houses the engine and can rotate a full axis so i can work comfy on this project.
i plan to try mount the turbos on the engine 1st by trying any means possible to get it to sit as close to the engine tucked away as possible.

im thinking tho that the oil filter outfeed will need to be relocated to an AM System wich is not hard at all.

my next concern is the flexi downpipes,i may haveto weld a stay to keep this at its most maximum down height while i trial fit the turbos,knowing the downpipes may need changing tho,this will just assist me in the fabrication of the project

any ideas and comments are welcome
~Q~

[Turbo_Steve]

Q: I'd get them onto the standard manifolds, no messing just drill the extra hole end get them mounted and see how they sit against the engine. Then I'd get said engine into the car and see what it looks like in terms of space. That is likely to make most of your decisions for you!

Also, bear in mind that those turbos you have are available with both 90degree and straight inlets: you can clock the inlet round on a 90degree, which may make custom inlet piping easier...or harder!

[VR4WGN]

really so i canrotate the inlets ? i thort theyd be fixed, but these aare the correct turbos you guys where talking about correct?

ok ill get them mounted onto the engine as it sits then and then worry bout the rest like you said?
~Q~

[Turbo_Steve]

If you've got the time and the cars, that'd be my approach. It may not go back in with the turbos on.....but it may slip in with no issues at all: It's got to be worth a try, if it saves you having to make up manifolds.

And yes, if you unbolt the strap on the turbos you can "clock" them inside the turbine housing. You can also clock the compressor housing against the bearing, though I believe you then have to replace the seals.

Those are the right turbos, however they are available with 90 degree inlets and straight inlets. Given how stupendously huge those 90 degreen inlets are, I suspect the straight inlet (which is much rarer) will be the choice for the VR4. However, other TD04 compressors and cartridge sections should mate up with those turbine housings.

You could, of course, simply cut the 90 degree inlet off and tig on a bit if ally pipe.

[Gly]

no the ones used have the straight inlet...

the one person who used the ones you have, cut off the bend to fit a straight,

the straight ones are not rare. i have 2, and found plenty to pick from when i was buying.

are you still on ozvr4 heres my td04 project,
hasn't gone any further due to lack of funding...

http://ozvr4.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4960


.

[VR4WGN]

lol Carsten reserve them post positions lol... um yea there is 2 on Trademe at the mo,not yours i take it.. but if these will work then why not use them? unless you reckon its best to get the str8 ones ..

Steve- im sure we remain confident we will not have any problems ey? lol