Differences 6a13 and 6a13tt shortblock.

[metaripley]

I would like to know what differences there are in the shortblock of these 2?

Oilsquirters maybe?

Basically, can a 6a13 shortblock be used in a 6a13tt application?

[Anderz]

At least oil return ports from the turbos are not open in the non-turbo block, same with oil feed for back turbo.

[lateshow]

I apart from those blocked oil lines everything "down below" is the same. Not the pistons though

[metaripley]

Are the crank and rods the same?

[adaxo]

Are the crank and rods the same?

According to ASA, yes.

[Nick Mann]

Someone has previously stated that the non turbo had a cheaper crank when originally built but as it is the same dimensions as the turbo, the spares on the shelf are all turbo versions. I have no idea if that statement was correct - I can't even remember who stated it.

[ersanalamin]

I would like to know what differences there are in the shortblock of these 2?

Oilsquirters maybe?

Basically, can a 6a13 shortblock be used in a 6a13tt application?

Dimension is the same, hole for water, oil in and out of turbo can be drilled but one should not use 6a13 n/a short block into 6a13tt because of crank shaft oil jetting. 2 oil jetting in each 6a13tt crank journal bearing and just one big oil jetting hole in 6a13 n/a. if you still insist then the journal bearing will be easily worn out. left pic is 6a13 n/a crank oil jetting and the right is 6a13tt crank oil jetting

[Grid]

Someone has previously stated that the non turbo had a cheaper crank when originally built but as it is the same dimensions as the turbo, the spares on the shelf are all turbo versions. I have no idea if that statement was correct - I can't even remember who stated it.

Wasn't it @swinks ?

[Nick Mann]

It might have been.

[swinks]

Yes, I was told by Tomek (kochajj) that after he blown engine 3 times in his 400+ mega build Legnum, each time crank he used from n/a engine just snapped, that he took cranks from Galant n/a and vr4 to machine shop for examination by some professional and to compare them and they pointed to him, that crank from n/a has weaker structure than that from vr4. Apparently there is difference in surface metal structure, somekinda hardening process, which I have little clue not being metallurgy engineer.

So in reality it may be urban myth at some point

[SAF68]

Hi all ,

If i can give my advice , to answer for the question of Metariplay , the answer is yes !!

And this why :


-About the Mitsubishi crankshaft , there are no difference na vs TT , both are forged and there is only one mitsubishi part code ( check asa) .If you have a vr4 or n/a and you go to mitsibishi dealer part , there is only one code for the crankshaft ..and one code = same parts , same surface metal structure.

-About main bearing , i saw the photos of ersanalamin about the oil jetting in the short block ( also thank's for the photos) ... Don't be worry to worn out. The 3SI communoty use to make big power or to 3.5 or 3.7 and 3.8 , short block come from 6G74 or 6G75 na like Mitsubish JDM Debonaire or 3.8 6G75 USDM Eclispe.

If you make some schearch on google , you will see that other monster engine like 2JZ from the supra don't use oil jetting.

Hope that you understand my english

Saf

[Davezj]

Just wondering if there was a possibility that there was a difference in the crank shafts and they originally had two different numbers but now mitsi in the there wisdom have decided to just make the VR4 crank shaft.

i suppose the only way to really check is get the chassis number of a N/A old galant and look at the part number for the crank and see if ASA has a part number change listed against it.

if the cranks that have broken came out older N\A galants they could have had a different crank. but if they came from a newer galant then they should have had the newer part number crank. it is just a thought.

[SAF68]

On the Mitsubishi motors for the crankshaft , you have 2 possibility .... Cast vs forged . An exemple , the first generation of 3000GT/GTO was used the cast crankshaft and second generarion use forged crankshaft.

Please all , click on the link to understand the difference withe two version of crank

http://www.3sx.com/faq/cranks/

I never see forged crank with different surface metal structure.. just 2 choices , cast vs forged and i NEVER see cast crank on 6A13 PFL or FL , VR4 or na.

Saf

[Davezj]

From the link you posted this is exactly what i thought might have happened.

"The 3000GT and Stealth went through a number of crank shaft part numbers, making the change from the cast version to a forged version starting in model year 93 (June 92 and later production dates). As of several years ago, the cast crank is no longer an available option through Mitsubishi, making the stronger forged crank the only available crank for the DOHC 3000GT/Stealth (whether turbo or not). The current forged crank is "backwards compatible", working in all years of the DOHC 3000GT/Stealth engines."

But if you say there has never been a cast crank fitted to an 8G N/A or Turbo engine, it does not really matter.


just out of interest what exactly does forged mean?

The use of the word forged as we use it, to take a part and perform a forging action on so the part can now be described as forged, this is not in the dictionary as a use of the word forge.
i thought it meant that a part was cast and had some additional machining done to it and then some sort of heat treatment to make harder/stronger.

i understand cast means metal is melted and cast in a mould then machined.
and billet means carved from a solid block of material but now i am not sure about the meaning of forged.

[Nick Mann]

Forged usually means that a lump of metal has been heated until very hot but still solid, then bashed very hard into the shape it needs to be.
This often gives directional properties to the finished forging and also often better properties than cast as the metal structure is different.
Sorry to simplify a technical field into two sentences but hopefully it gives you an idea.

[adaxo]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4wKP1E0wr3Y

[Davezj]

that is amazing i nver considered you could punch a crank shaft out of red hot metal.

that is a proper OMG moment for me.
i know it has to be machined afterwards but that is still very impressive technology.